Only if you're very close, very patient, and very particular with shot placement. My personal philosophy for this is "nothing smaller than a .25 caliber, no bullet smaller than 100 grains". Leave the .223 for varmints and predators.
Me my self i wouldnt use it but we all have our different opinions no matter what we say if its legal and your comfortable with it use it i use a small caliber myself my trusty 25-06 and i have other guns but i comfortable with it and every deer i shot has been one shot ive never lost a deer using this rifle in the past three years ive took 12 deer with this gun including my biggest.i read an article in gunhunter magazine the other day where they did a study on the .223 and others even smaller cal. they did it on a farm in north carolina during whitetail season and they determined it dont matter what cal. that you choose its all in shot placement all the deer shot in the front shoulder with the .223 on average just traveled 14yd which was pretty surprising to me but it just goes to show if you shoot a gun enough get use to it to where you know exactly what your gun is capable of doing and your confident in your shooting abilyties you can take a deer with any cal. good luck!!
A 55 grain soft nose bullet in the lungs will work fantastic and I’ve shot more deer with my 22-250 than all my rifles put together. I get just as much of a blood trail and bang flop with 223 and 22-250 as with a 30-06. When the lungs are turned to mush they are not going any further than if you hit them with a 50 BMG!
From Clays archives of bookmarks, places, information and things to read,
ken.mcloud said it best!
“So, I think that the superior killing power of larger rounds is largely in our heads.(likely testosterone induced) A flat-shooting round that you can accurately place will produce as many if not more "bang-flop" kills as a heavy caliber round.”
I had considerable difficulty accepting the .223/5.56mm as a military cartridge, though it unquestionably kills men in combat. Let me avoid ambiguity; the .223 can certainly kill deer (so can a Philipine blow-dart), but if your intention is to harvest venison, I have to agree with those who recommend a twenty-four or twenty-five caliber rifle as a minimum because my priority is to kill cleanly, quickly, humanely, with a bullet that will accomplish the task reliably. If I see one more shallow wound or poorly placed bullet provided by a varmint bullet that subjects deer to a lingering death, I will write a three-page rant on this forum. If you want to use your .223 as a deer cartridge, you had best be a very patient, very accurate hunter and be in accordance with your state's hunting regulations. If you want to kill deer reliably, provide yourself the tools to do so.
In summary: Yes, if David could kill Goliath with a well-placed stone, you can believe a .223 can kill deer with good placement. Reach beyond the minimum.
My opinion is no more valid or weighty than others. Consider it BS, if you choose to do so. The .223 is a fine varmint cartridge. I do not respect it or recommend it as a deer cartridge. I would use it if I was in "survival mode", but I have not encountered that necessity. Since I normally plan ahead and tailor my needs accordingly, I make other choices. For the record, my favorite deer rifle is a Winchester Model 70 Lightweight Carbine chambered for the .250 Savage...and that's as light as I care to go.
I have shot several white tail deer with the 223 out to 250 yards. Use a good bullet and with good shot placement in the lung area they drop in there tracks. With the 223 you loose less meat also. A good lung or heart shot the 223 does a wonderful job.
I think one of you asks this dumb@$$ question once a month just to get a rise.
Go ahead, use a .22 centerfire if your state allows it. Many don't for good reason......it's not a great deer caliber. just listen to all the "if's" with the .223 and then decide. I think I will start carrying my Gamo air rifle goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a .177 air rifle. LOL
WA Mtnhunter: I am not on here very often to know this question get asked a lot. And it's not a dumb question. In fact maybe your dumb for thinking its dumb. And a .223 is all I have. I don't have enough money for a better deer rifle.
Oh, and I think im gonna start using my truck for goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a truck.
no it is not, why because its bullets are designed with wood chucks , coyotes and the like in mind . not white tailed deer . do your self and the deer a favor buy at least a 243.win .
I knew a guy who, back in the 1920's or 30's shot a nice buck with .22 rimfire shorts and killed. He shot it right above the eye from a short distance. It is true that you can cleanly harvest a deer with a .223. However, I would like to have some insurance on my side in the event of not getting an absolutely perfect shot, like you would need with a .223. I would suggest you use at least a .243
It'll kill a deer with extremely good shot placement...but I wouldn't use it for deer. As many have already touched upon, a .243 is probably the lowest calibur to be using on deer.
A point for cooner. The bullet in factory loads is designed to break up on impact, for smaller game. Even as a military round (and I doubt if your rifle is chambered for the military version), it's intended to inflict disabling wounds, though it will definintely kill.
If it's legal where you are, the only thing you've got (no shotgun?), and you're bent on killing a deer with it, sound's like you already made the decision.
I am reminded of the scene from Into the Wild, where he kills an Alaskan moose with a .22cal semiauto. Took quite a few rounds, and made a lot of hamburger, but eventually the moose stopped walking. I hope your deer doesn't require that much.
i've heard of neck shots dropping deer in their tracks with a 223 but in my state 243 is legal minimum and i personally wouldn't ethically hunt with it. it matters where you place the bullet not how big it is
I used to have an ar-15 with scope I bought off a buddy. Used it to hunt a few times. Was a great gun. As far as power goes it will kill anything it shoots. Just have to make sure you have a good shot. Not a real accurate gun too far out. I tried to keep it within 50 yards. If your looking to buy a gun go with a 270 or 243! You will have a much better choice of how to hunt and where. The 223 isnt legal everywhere and for everything such as bear, moose, other big game!
It can take down a deer but you need a damn neer perfect shot with a little bit of luck. I personally wouldn't use one. It is nearly cruelty to animals to use one because there is a HIGH possibility of injuring the animal w/o kill.
use what you like its all personal choice anyway even if we dont all agree on each others choices we cant take it personally and put each other down everyone .so if a 223 is legal in your state go for it .as clay says hit mop and you will be fine a 223 will kill a deer to say it will not is just someone who is miss informed or has no shooting abilty with small cailbers or just like the extra power of larger cailber and that not a bad thing eitheir but placemnt is the key with any rifle but a 223 will not have the damage a larger cailber bullet will or the pack out range in my opion .but it will kill a deer if you have the abilty to make good shoots
best of luck this season to all
In GA the hunting regs state " a .22 caliber or larger centerfire with an expanding bullet" or something to that effect.
FWIW, I don't make a practice of hunting with smaller rounds with deer (with some exceptions). I know it's possible. I get chided a lot for using 'them big magnums' and for tearing up meat. I have also NEVER lost one, or had to track one more than 50 feet. That being said, I participated in a doe cull at a friend's place at the end of a season a while back and I did use my .223 AR. And it worked. It worked well in fact. I didn't tear up as much meat and the two I took bang/flopped like Maxwell's Silver Hammer hit 'em. I was sorta impressed. After thinking things through I was right back to the 7mm Rem. Mag and 270 WSM only because some of the places I hunt are potential long shots and if I shoot a creature, I want there to be no suffering, no fight, lights out.
My Dad had shoulder surgery last year right before the season, and any kind of recoil drove him mad from the pain. He was not going to be denied his deer hunting, and borrowed a 22-250. He then had his best deer season yet with most killed, longest shot, and largest buck of our group. Go figure. But he is of the same mindset as me too; He's back to 270 Win and now a 7mm Rem Mag. Same reasoning as me.
So yes it's possible. I have done it. Others(Clay) do it. I am not down on anyone for what caliber choice. I choose to use something that is maybe overkill. If you have something working for you, carry on. Anyone/everyone opining here is telling you their recommendations and what works for them.
I would rather have it(a round with extra a$$) and not need it, than need it and not have it.
Yep, I'm just dumb I guess. But I was smart enough to buy the only rifle I had in something a wee bit bigger than .223 Rem. If that's the only rifle you can handle, maybe Clay will invite you to go hunting with him! LOL
hell yea itl work..dont listn to what some are sayin like WA Mtnhunter...sounds to me like he needs to change his attitude..ive seen 22. rimfires kill at least 6 deer in my county.and hey if thats all you can afford go for it...native americans could kill deer with slower loader bows when nowa days we have fast quiet bows.and for WA Mtnhunter you should be quiet man...cummon..we're all hunters and maybe hes just startn out and doesnt have enough for a larger gun..desnt mean you should call eachother stupid..when you first started huntn im sure you didnt know alot about huntn did you..how bout you try to be a lil nicer...and good luck to all yall this year in the woods
Wa Mtnhunter - FWIW,I +1'd you on that last one because I know hidden within your sarcastic wit the message you are really trying to send is " use something that will make a clean ethical kill and don't chance wounding an animal".
There are two schools of thought in play here and folks are adamant about what is working or not working for them. Four-wheelin, I hope the hunting is good for you, and I hope you have excellent results.
Just remember there is wisdom in the counsel of others.
I'v taken 2 does with my 220 swift, one ran about 30 yards and the other just fell over dead. Shoot behind the shoulder just like you would with any other gun and you should be just fine. Have fun!
223 or 700 Nitro Express in the boiler room, when the lungs are blown out it doesn't matter! I use regular 55 grain Hornady soft points in my 22-250 and taken deer out to 700 yards with no problem. The only real problem at longer range when I would have preferred my 25-06 was because of wind. Speaking of wind, sure is a lot of it here LOL! 350 yards on a Monster Mule Deer with a 223? NO PROBLEM!
You are correct, my friend. I did get a little carried away with my sarcastic response. For that I apologize.
I have found a few too many deer wounded with .223 or other small bores rotting in the woods unrecovered by the shooter to keep quiet on the subject. Many states and provinces require a .23 or .24 caliber minimum for deer and larger game - that means a .243 or bigger. That is targeted for the average hunter, not the experienced ones who might use a .22-250 with a Nosler Partition, barnes X, or other good bullet, who might use a FMJ or frangible SP out of ignorance. Plenty of ignorance around too.
Sorry for the sarcastic response. Read all the posts. You might note that the number of responses likely indicates that it is a controversial issue. If you had asked if a .257 or .308 was adequate for deer, you might have gotten a half dozen replies, all agreeing......
Please don't use a 223. If money is the issue a used NEF handi rifle in 243 or 308 can be had for around 175.00. A 12 or 20 gage shotgun with improved cylinder choke and slugs are a better option than a 223 for deer.
This is a volitile issue for sure. However, I am here to tell you that the .223 will kill deer just as dead as any of the other bullets if placed in a kill zone. You do have to use hunting bullets and you do have to hit a vital zone... you do that, your deer is dead. Cripples don't run around because of .223's, they run around because of bad shots. I once chased a gut shot buck for four miles that a turkey hunter blasted with a 30-06.... does that make the 30-06 a bad deer rifle? If you look at statistical results of deer shot in vital areas with a .223 to a 375H&H, you will see almost identical results; all deer being killed and lying within 30-50 yards of impact. I suspect that the reason there is such strong feeling for the .223 is that bolt action hunters might assume that black gun idiots are mindlessly spraying the timbers on full auto to reap a crippled deer or two. Just for an example, my niece's .223 buck at 150 yards last fall was hit in the chest with a facing shot. The 55g hunting bullet penetrated the spine, disintigrated three vertebraes and exited in front of the hind quarters... deer killed instantly... as a matter of fact, I have rarely seen a deer drop faster. I consider the .223 to be just as deadly a rifle as my .375H&H but am aware that the .375 will retain its power after going through two pine trees and the .223 won't. Here in Georgia, a .223 is legal for deer hunting and I would not hesitate to use one except that I will be using my 25-06 for better all around flexibilty considering range and wooded conditions. I certainly think cartriges between 25-06 and 30-06 are more versatile for deer hunting but I have no doubt that if a hunter uses a .223, they can be quite successful as long as they know how to deer hunt similar to any other caliber.
I had considerable difficulty accepting the .223/5.56mm as a military cartridge, though it unquestionably kills men in combat. Let me avoid ambiguity; the .223 can certainly kill deer (so can a Philipine blow-dart), but if your intention is to harvest venison, I have to agree with those who recommend a twenty-four or twenty-five caliber rifle as a minimum because my priority is to kill cleanly, quickly, humanely, with a bullet that will accomplish the task reliably. If I see one more shallow wound or poorly placed bullet provided by a varmint bullet that subjects deer to a lingering death, I will write a three-page rant on this forum. If you want to use your .223 as a deer cartridge, you had best be a very patient, very accurate hunter and be in accordance with your state's hunting regulations. If you want to kill deer reliably, provide yourself the tools to do so.
In summary: Yes, if David could kill Goliath with a well-placed stone, you can believe a .223 can kill deer with good placement. Reach beyond the minimum.
My opinion is no more valid or weighty than others. Consider it BS, if you choose to do so. The .223 is a fine varmint cartridge. I do not respect it or recommend it as a deer cartridge. I would use it if I was in "survival mode", but I have not encountered that necessity. Since I normally plan ahead and tailor my needs accordingly, I make other choices. For the record, my favorite deer rifle is a Winchester Model 70 Lightweight Carbine chambered for the .250 Savage...and that's as light as I care to go.
Only if you're very close, very patient, and very particular with shot placement. My personal philosophy for this is "nothing smaller than a .25 caliber, no bullet smaller than 100 grains". Leave the .223 for varmints and predators.
Me my self i wouldnt use it but we all have our different opinions no matter what we say if its legal and your comfortable with it use it i use a small caliber myself my trusty 25-06 and i have other guns but i comfortable with it and every deer i shot has been one shot ive never lost a deer using this rifle in the past three years ive took 12 deer with this gun including my biggest.i read an article in gunhunter magazine the other day where they did a study on the .223 and others even smaller cal. they did it on a farm in north carolina during whitetail season and they determined it dont matter what cal. that you choose its all in shot placement all the deer shot in the front shoulder with the .223 on average just traveled 14yd which was pretty surprising to me but it just goes to show if you shoot a gun enough get use to it to where you know exactly what your gun is capable of doing and your confident in your shooting abilyties you can take a deer with any cal. good luck!!
use what you like its all personal choice anyway even if we dont all agree on each others choices we cant take it personally and put each other down everyone .so if a 223 is legal in your state go for it .as clay says hit mop and you will be fine a 223 will kill a deer to say it will not is just someone who is miss informed or has no shooting abilty with small cailbers or just like the extra power of larger cailber and that not a bad thing eitheir but placemnt is the key with any rifle but a 223 will not have the damage a larger cailber bullet will or the pack out range in my opion .but it will kill a deer if you have the abilty to make good shoots
best of luck this season to all
In GA the hunting regs state " a .22 caliber or larger centerfire with an expanding bullet" or something to that effect.
FWIW, I don't make a practice of hunting with smaller rounds with deer (with some exceptions). I know it's possible. I get chided a lot for using 'them big magnums' and for tearing up meat. I have also NEVER lost one, or had to track one more than 50 feet. That being said, I participated in a doe cull at a friend's place at the end of a season a while back and I did use my .223 AR. And it worked. It worked well in fact. I didn't tear up as much meat and the two I took bang/flopped like Maxwell's Silver Hammer hit 'em. I was sorta impressed. After thinking things through I was right back to the 7mm Rem. Mag and 270 WSM only because some of the places I hunt are potential long shots and if I shoot a creature, I want there to be no suffering, no fight, lights out.
My Dad had shoulder surgery last year right before the season, and any kind of recoil drove him mad from the pain. He was not going to be denied his deer hunting, and borrowed a 22-250. He then had his best deer season yet with most killed, longest shot, and largest buck of our group. Go figure. But he is of the same mindset as me too; He's back to 270 Win and now a 7mm Rem Mag. Same reasoning as me.
So yes it's possible. I have done it. Others(Clay) do it. I am not down on anyone for what caliber choice. I choose to use something that is maybe overkill. If you have something working for you, carry on. Anyone/everyone opining here is telling you their recommendations and what works for them.
I would rather have it(a round with extra a$$) and not need it, than need it and not have it.
I have shot several white tail deer with the 223 out to 250 yards. Use a good bullet and with good shot placement in the lung area they drop in there tracks. With the 223 you loose less meat also. A good lung or heart shot the 223 does a wonderful job.
WA Mtnhunter: I am not on here very often to know this question get asked a lot. And it's not a dumb question. In fact maybe your dumb for thinking its dumb. And a .223 is all I have. I don't have enough money for a better deer rifle.
Oh, and I think im gonna start using my truck for goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a truck.
It'll kill a deer with extremely good shot placement...but I wouldn't use it for deer. As many have already touched upon, a .243 is probably the lowest calibur to be using on deer.
It can take down a deer but you need a damn neer perfect shot with a little bit of luck. I personally wouldn't use one. It is nearly cruelty to animals to use one because there is a HIGH possibility of injuring the animal w/o kill.
I'v taken 2 does with my 220 swift, one ran about 30 yards and the other just fell over dead. Shoot behind the shoulder just like you would with any other gun and you should be just fine. Have fun!
223 or 700 Nitro Express in the boiler room, when the lungs are blown out it doesn't matter! I use regular 55 grain Hornady soft points in my 22-250 and taken deer out to 700 yards with no problem. The only real problem at longer range when I would have preferred my 25-06 was because of wind. Speaking of wind, sure is a lot of it here LOL! 350 yards on a Monster Mule Deer with a 223? NO PROBLEM!
Sorry for the sarcastic response. Read all the posts. You might note that the number of responses likely indicates that it is a controversial issue. If you had asked if a .257 or .308 was adequate for deer, you might have gotten a half dozen replies, all agreeing......
A 55 grain soft nose bullet in the lungs will work fantastic and I’ve shot more deer with my 22-250 than all my rifles put together. I get just as much of a blood trail and bang flop with 223 and 22-250 as with a 30-06. When the lungs are turned to mush they are not going any further than if you hit them with a 50 BMG!
From Clays archives of bookmarks, places, information and things to read,
ken.mcloud said it best!
“So, I think that the superior killing power of larger rounds is largely in our heads.(likely testosterone induced) A flat-shooting round that you can accurately place will produce as many if not more "bang-flop" kills as a heavy caliber round.”
I think one of you asks this dumb@$$ question once a month just to get a rise.
Go ahead, use a .22 centerfire if your state allows it. Many don't for good reason......it's not a great deer caliber. just listen to all the "if's" with the .223 and then decide. I think I will start carrying my Gamo air rifle goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a .177 air rifle. LOL
no it is not, why because its bullets are designed with wood chucks , coyotes and the like in mind . not white tailed deer . do your self and the deer a favor buy at least a 243.win .
I knew a guy who, back in the 1920's or 30's shot a nice buck with .22 rimfire shorts and killed. He shot it right above the eye from a short distance. It is true that you can cleanly harvest a deer with a .223. However, I would like to have some insurance on my side in the event of not getting an absolutely perfect shot, like you would need with a .223. I would suggest you use at least a .243
A point for cooner. The bullet in factory loads is designed to break up on impact, for smaller game. Even as a military round (and I doubt if your rifle is chambered for the military version), it's intended to inflict disabling wounds, though it will definintely kill.
If it's legal where you are, the only thing you've got (no shotgun?), and you're bent on killing a deer with it, sound's like you already made the decision.
I am reminded of the scene from Into the Wild, where he kills an Alaskan moose with a .22cal semiauto. Took quite a few rounds, and made a lot of hamburger, but eventually the moose stopped walking. I hope your deer doesn't require that much.
I used to have an ar-15 with scope I bought off a buddy. Used it to hunt a few times. Was a great gun. As far as power goes it will kill anything it shoots. Just have to make sure you have a good shot. Not a real accurate gun too far out. I tried to keep it within 50 yards. If your looking to buy a gun go with a 270 or 243! You will have a much better choice of how to hunt and where. The 223 isnt legal everywhere and for everything such as bear, moose, other big game!
Yep, I'm just dumb I guess. But I was smart enough to buy the only rifle I had in something a wee bit bigger than .223 Rem. If that's the only rifle you can handle, maybe Clay will invite you to go hunting with him! LOL
hell yea itl work..dont listn to what some are sayin like WA Mtnhunter...sounds to me like he needs to change his attitude..ive seen 22. rimfires kill at least 6 deer in my county.and hey if thats all you can afford go for it...native americans could kill deer with slower loader bows when nowa days we have fast quiet bows.and for WA Mtnhunter you should be quiet man...cummon..we're all hunters and maybe hes just startn out and doesnt have enough for a larger gun..desnt mean you should call eachother stupid..when you first started huntn im sure you didnt know alot about huntn did you..how bout you try to be a lil nicer...and good luck to all yall this year in the woods
You are correct, my friend. I did get a little carried away with my sarcastic response. For that I apologize.
I have found a few too many deer wounded with .223 or other small bores rotting in the woods unrecovered by the shooter to keep quiet on the subject. Many states and provinces require a .23 or .24 caliber minimum for deer and larger game - that means a .243 or bigger. That is targeted for the average hunter, not the experienced ones who might use a .22-250 with a Nosler Partition, barnes X, or other good bullet, who might use a FMJ or frangible SP out of ignorance. Plenty of ignorance around too.
This is a volitile issue for sure. However, I am here to tell you that the .223 will kill deer just as dead as any of the other bullets if placed in a kill zone. You do have to use hunting bullets and you do have to hit a vital zone... you do that, your deer is dead. Cripples don't run around because of .223's, they run around because of bad shots. I once chased a gut shot buck for four miles that a turkey hunter blasted with a 30-06.... does that make the 30-06 a bad deer rifle? If you look at statistical results of deer shot in vital areas with a .223 to a 375H&H, you will see almost identical results; all deer being killed and lying within 30-50 yards of impact. I suspect that the reason there is such strong feeling for the .223 is that bolt action hunters might assume that black gun idiots are mindlessly spraying the timbers on full auto to reap a crippled deer or two. Just for an example, my niece's .223 buck at 150 yards last fall was hit in the chest with a facing shot. The 55g hunting bullet penetrated the spine, disintigrated three vertebraes and exited in front of the hind quarters... deer killed instantly... as a matter of fact, I have rarely seen a deer drop faster. I consider the .223 to be just as deadly a rifle as my .375H&H but am aware that the .375 will retain its power after going through two pine trees and the .223 won't. Here in Georgia, a .223 is legal for deer hunting and I would not hesitate to use one except that I will be using my 25-06 for better all around flexibilty considering range and wooded conditions. I certainly think cartriges between 25-06 and 30-06 are more versatile for deer hunting but I have no doubt that if a hunter uses a .223, they can be quite successful as long as they know how to deer hunt similar to any other caliber.
i've heard of neck shots dropping deer in their tracks with a 223 but in my state 243 is legal minimum and i personally wouldn't ethically hunt with it. it matters where you place the bullet not how big it is
Wa Mtnhunter - FWIW,I +1'd you on that last one because I know hidden within your sarcastic wit the message you are really trying to send is " use something that will make a clean ethical kill and don't chance wounding an animal".
There are two schools of thought in play here and folks are adamant about what is working or not working for them. Four-wheelin, I hope the hunting is good for you, and I hope you have excellent results.
Just remember there is wisdom in the counsel of others.
Please don't use a 223. If money is the issue a used NEF handi rifle in 243 or 308 can be had for around 175.00. A 12 or 20 gage shotgun with improved cylinder choke and slugs are a better option than a 223 for deer.
Answers (40)
Only if you're very close, very patient, and very particular with shot placement. My personal philosophy for this is "nothing smaller than a .25 caliber, no bullet smaller than 100 grains". Leave the .223 for varmints and predators.
A 270 is better .223 is not legal in many places.
No I dont think its big enough for deer.
It will probably do the job but it is quite risky. I personally wouldn't use it. Go to at least a .243.
State law will mandate if you can use it. Iowa says no.
Me my self i wouldnt use it but we all have our different opinions no matter what we say if its legal and your comfortable with it use it i use a small caliber myself my trusty 25-06 and i have other guns but i comfortable with it and every deer i shot has been one shot ive never lost a deer using this rifle in the past three years ive took 12 deer with this gun including my biggest.i read an article in gunhunter magazine the other day where they did a study on the .223 and others even smaller cal. they did it on a farm in north carolina during whitetail season and they determined it dont matter what cal. that you choose its all in shot placement all the deer shot in the front shoulder with the .223 on average just traveled 14yd which was pretty surprising to me but it just goes to show if you shoot a gun enough get use to it to where you know exactly what your gun is capable of doing and your confident in your shooting abilyties you can take a deer with any cal. good luck!!
O”Here we go again!
A 55 grain soft nose bullet in the lungs will work fantastic and I’ve shot more deer with my 22-250 than all my rifles put together. I get just as much of a blood trail and bang flop with 223 and 22-250 as with a 30-06. When the lungs are turned to mush they are not going any further than if you hit them with a 50 BMG!
From Clays archives of bookmarks, places, information and things to read,
ken.mcloud said it best!
“So, I think that the superior killing power of larger rounds is largely in our heads.(likely testosterone induced) A flat-shooting round that you can accurately place will produce as many if not more "bang-flop" kills as a heavy caliber round.”
jordjohn44
You just might have to use that shovel for some of the BS your hearing, what you think!
I had considerable difficulty accepting the .223/5.56mm as a military cartridge, though it unquestionably kills men in combat. Let me avoid ambiguity; the .223 can certainly kill deer (so can a Philipine blow-dart), but if your intention is to harvest venison, I have to agree with those who recommend a twenty-four or twenty-five caliber rifle as a minimum because my priority is to kill cleanly, quickly, humanely, with a bullet that will accomplish the task reliably. If I see one more shallow wound or poorly placed bullet provided by a varmint bullet that subjects deer to a lingering death, I will write a three-page rant on this forum. If you want to use your .223 as a deer cartridge, you had best be a very patient, very accurate hunter and be in accordance with your state's hunting regulations. If you want to kill deer reliably, provide yourself the tools to do so.
In summary: Yes, if David could kill Goliath with a well-placed stone, you can believe a .223 can kill deer with good placement. Reach beyond the minimum.
My opinion is no more valid or weighty than others. Consider it BS, if you choose to do so. The .223 is a fine varmint cartridge. I do not respect it or recommend it as a deer cartridge. I would use it if I was in "survival mode", but I have not encountered that necessity. Since I normally plan ahead and tailor my needs accordingly, I make other choices. For the record, my favorite deer rifle is a Winchester Model 70 Lightweight Carbine chambered for the .250 Savage...and that's as light as I care to go.
I have shot several white tail deer with the 223 out to 250 yards. Use a good bullet and with good shot placement in the lung area they drop in there tracks. With the 223 you loose less meat also. A good lung or heart shot the 223 does a wonderful job.
Only if you are really close. Even then, i wouldnt risk it.
packerfan sounds like a "MOP" problem, :)
I think one of you asks this dumb@$$ question once a month just to get a rise.
Go ahead, use a .22 centerfire if your state allows it. Many don't for good reason......it's not a great deer caliber. just listen to all the "if's" with the .223 and then decide. I think I will start carrying my Gamo air rifle goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a .177 air rifle. LOL
If its all you have then use it if it is legal in your state.
WA Mtnhunter: I am not on here very often to know this question get asked a lot. And it's not a dumb question. In fact maybe your dumb for thinking its dumb. And a .223 is all I have. I don't have enough money for a better deer rifle.
Oh, and I think im gonna start using my truck for goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a truck.
See how stupid that sounds?
Or maybe I will just use a golf club... It is possible to kill a goose with a golf club too.
Why? please answer that. why? Not your best choice.
no it is not, why because its bullets are designed with wood chucks , coyotes and the like in mind . not white tailed deer . do your self and the deer a favor buy at least a 243.win .
I knew a guy who, back in the 1920's or 30's shot a nice buck with .22 rimfire shorts and killed. He shot it right above the eye from a short distance. It is true that you can cleanly harvest a deer with a .223. However, I would like to have some insurance on my side in the event of not getting an absolutely perfect shot, like you would need with a .223. I would suggest you use at least a .243
It'll kill a deer with extremely good shot placement...but I wouldn't use it for deer. As many have already touched upon, a .243 is probably the lowest calibur to be using on deer.
A point for cooner. The bullet in factory loads is designed to break up on impact, for smaller game. Even as a military round (and I doubt if your rifle is chambered for the military version), it's intended to inflict disabling wounds, though it will definintely kill.
If it's legal where you are, the only thing you've got (no shotgun?), and you're bent on killing a deer with it, sound's like you already made the decision.
I am reminded of the scene from Into the Wild, where he kills an Alaskan moose with a .22cal semiauto. Took quite a few rounds, and made a lot of hamburger, but eventually the moose stopped walking. I hope your deer doesn't require that much.
i've heard of neck shots dropping deer in their tracks with a 223 but in my state 243 is legal minimum and i personally wouldn't ethically hunt with it. it matters where you place the bullet not how big it is
I used to have an ar-15 with scope I bought off a buddy. Used it to hunt a few times. Was a great gun. As far as power goes it will kill anything it shoots. Just have to make sure you have a good shot. Not a real accurate gun too far out. I tried to keep it within 50 yards. If your looking to buy a gun go with a 270 or 243! You will have a much better choice of how to hunt and where. The 223 isnt legal everywhere and for everything such as bear, moose, other big game!
yes,all depends where you put the bullet,i have seen alot of deer taken with 223.
It can take down a deer but you need a damn neer perfect shot with a little bit of luck. I personally wouldn't use one. It is nearly cruelty to animals to use one because there is a HIGH possibility of injuring the animal w/o kill.
use what you like its all personal choice anyway even if we dont all agree on each others choices we cant take it personally and put each other down everyone .so if a 223 is legal in your state go for it .as clay says hit mop and you will be fine a 223 will kill a deer to say it will not is just someone who is miss informed or has no shooting abilty with small cailbers or just like the extra power of larger cailber and that not a bad thing eitheir but placemnt is the key with any rifle but a 223 will not have the damage a larger cailber bullet will or the pack out range in my opion .but it will kill a deer if you have the abilty to make good shoots
best of luck this season to all
Saskatchewan requires min 23 caliber. So as far as I know that means a 243.
It will work, just wont get as big a wound channel as some of the large calibers, so just make sure the shot is well placed.
In GA the hunting regs state " a .22 caliber or larger centerfire with an expanding bullet" or something to that effect.
FWIW, I don't make a practice of hunting with smaller rounds with deer (with some exceptions). I know it's possible. I get chided a lot for using 'them big magnums' and for tearing up meat. I have also NEVER lost one, or had to track one more than 50 feet. That being said, I participated in a doe cull at a friend's place at the end of a season a while back and I did use my .223 AR. And it worked. It worked well in fact. I didn't tear up as much meat and the two I took bang/flopped like Maxwell's Silver Hammer hit 'em. I was sorta impressed. After thinking things through I was right back to the 7mm Rem. Mag and 270 WSM only because some of the places I hunt are potential long shots and if I shoot a creature, I want there to be no suffering, no fight, lights out.
My Dad had shoulder surgery last year right before the season, and any kind of recoil drove him mad from the pain. He was not going to be denied his deer hunting, and borrowed a 22-250. He then had his best deer season yet with most killed, longest shot, and largest buck of our group. Go figure. But he is of the same mindset as me too; He's back to 270 Win and now a 7mm Rem Mag. Same reasoning as me.
So yes it's possible. I have done it. Others(Clay) do it. I am not down on anyone for what caliber choice. I choose to use something that is maybe overkill. If you have something working for you, carry on. Anyone/everyone opining here is telling you their recommendations and what works for them.
I would rather have it(a round with extra a$$) and not need it, than need it and not have it.
Yep, I'm just dumb I guess. But I was smart enough to buy the only rifle I had in something a wee bit bigger than .223 Rem. If that's the only rifle you can handle, maybe Clay will invite you to go hunting with him! LOL
I'd use somthing a little bigger. Try a 270 i think its a great gun
hell yea itl work..dont listn to what some are sayin like WA Mtnhunter...sounds to me like he needs to change his attitude..ive seen 22. rimfires kill at least 6 deer in my county.and hey if thats all you can afford go for it...native americans could kill deer with slower loader bows when nowa days we have fast quiet bows.and for WA Mtnhunter you should be quiet man...cummon..we're all hunters and maybe hes just startn out and doesnt have enough for a larger gun..desnt mean you should call eachother stupid..when you first started huntn im sure you didnt know alot about huntn did you..how bout you try to be a lil nicer...and good luck to all yall this year in the woods
Wa Mtnhunter - FWIW,I +1'd you on that last one because I know hidden within your sarcastic wit the message you are really trying to send is " use something that will make a clean ethical kill and don't chance wounding an animal".
There are two schools of thought in play here and folks are adamant about what is working or not working for them. Four-wheelin, I hope the hunting is good for you, and I hope you have excellent results.
Just remember there is wisdom in the counsel of others.
I'v taken 2 does with my 220 swift, one ran about 30 yards and the other just fell over dead. Shoot behind the shoulder just like you would with any other gun and you should be just fine. Have fun!
223 or 700 Nitro Express in the boiler room, when the lungs are blown out it doesn't matter! I use regular 55 grain Hornady soft points in my 22-250 and taken deer out to 700 yards with no problem. The only real problem at longer range when I would have preferred my 25-06 was because of wind. Speaking of wind, sure is a lot of it here LOL! 350 yards on a Monster Mule Deer with a 223? NO PROBLEM!
sgaredneck
four-wheelin
You are correct, my friend. I did get a little carried away with my sarcastic response. For that I apologize.
I have found a few too many deer wounded with .223 or other small bores rotting in the woods unrecovered by the shooter to keep quiet on the subject. Many states and provinces require a .23 or .24 caliber minimum for deer and larger game - that means a .243 or bigger. That is targeted for the average hunter, not the experienced ones who might use a .22-250 with a Nosler Partition, barnes X, or other good bullet, who might use a FMJ or frangible SP out of ignorance. Plenty of ignorance around too.
four wheelin
Sorry for the sarcastic response. Read all the posts. You might note that the number of responses likely indicates that it is a controversial issue. If you had asked if a .257 or .308 was adequate for deer, you might have gotten a half dozen replies, all agreeing......
Please don't use a 223. If money is the issue a used NEF handi rifle in 243 or 308 can be had for around 175.00. A 12 or 20 gage shotgun with improved cylinder choke and slugs are a better option than a 223 for deer.
This is a volitile issue for sure. However, I am here to tell you that the .223 will kill deer just as dead as any of the other bullets if placed in a kill zone. You do have to use hunting bullets and you do have to hit a vital zone... you do that, your deer is dead. Cripples don't run around because of .223's, they run around because of bad shots. I once chased a gut shot buck for four miles that a turkey hunter blasted with a 30-06.... does that make the 30-06 a bad deer rifle? If you look at statistical results of deer shot in vital areas with a .223 to a 375H&H, you will see almost identical results; all deer being killed and lying within 30-50 yards of impact. I suspect that the reason there is such strong feeling for the .223 is that bolt action hunters might assume that black gun idiots are mindlessly spraying the timbers on full auto to reap a crippled deer or two. Just for an example, my niece's .223 buck at 150 yards last fall was hit in the chest with a facing shot. The 55g hunting bullet penetrated the spine, disintigrated three vertebraes and exited in front of the hind quarters... deer killed instantly... as a matter of fact, I have rarely seen a deer drop faster. I consider the .223 to be just as deadly a rifle as my .375H&H but am aware that the .375 will retain its power after going through two pine trees and the .223 won't. Here in Georgia, a .223 is legal for deer hunting and I would not hesitate to use one except that I will be using my 25-06 for better all around flexibilty considering range and wooded conditions. I certainly think cartriges between 25-06 and 30-06 are more versatile for deer hunting but I have no doubt that if a hunter uses a .223, they can be quite successful as long as they know how to deer hunt similar to any other caliber.
If you are within 100-200 yards. I would suggest you should get something bigger just in case your deer is farther out.
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I had considerable difficulty accepting the .223/5.56mm as a military cartridge, though it unquestionably kills men in combat. Let me avoid ambiguity; the .223 can certainly kill deer (so can a Philipine blow-dart), but if your intention is to harvest venison, I have to agree with those who recommend a twenty-four or twenty-five caliber rifle as a minimum because my priority is to kill cleanly, quickly, humanely, with a bullet that will accomplish the task reliably. If I see one more shallow wound or poorly placed bullet provided by a varmint bullet that subjects deer to a lingering death, I will write a three-page rant on this forum. If you want to use your .223 as a deer cartridge, you had best be a very patient, very accurate hunter and be in accordance with your state's hunting regulations. If you want to kill deer reliably, provide yourself the tools to do so.
In summary: Yes, if David could kill Goliath with a well-placed stone, you can believe a .223 can kill deer with good placement. Reach beyond the minimum.
My opinion is no more valid or weighty than others. Consider it BS, if you choose to do so. The .223 is a fine varmint cartridge. I do not respect it or recommend it as a deer cartridge. I would use it if I was in "survival mode", but I have not encountered that necessity. Since I normally plan ahead and tailor my needs accordingly, I make other choices. For the record, my favorite deer rifle is a Winchester Model 70 Lightweight Carbine chambered for the .250 Savage...and that's as light as I care to go.
Only if you're very close, very patient, and very particular with shot placement. My personal philosophy for this is "nothing smaller than a .25 caliber, no bullet smaller than 100 grains". Leave the .223 for varmints and predators.
Me my self i wouldnt use it but we all have our different opinions no matter what we say if its legal and your comfortable with it use it i use a small caliber myself my trusty 25-06 and i have other guns but i comfortable with it and every deer i shot has been one shot ive never lost a deer using this rifle in the past three years ive took 12 deer with this gun including my biggest.i read an article in gunhunter magazine the other day where they did a study on the .223 and others even smaller cal. they did it on a farm in north carolina during whitetail season and they determined it dont matter what cal. that you choose its all in shot placement all the deer shot in the front shoulder with the .223 on average just traveled 14yd which was pretty surprising to me but it just goes to show if you shoot a gun enough get use to it to where you know exactly what your gun is capable of doing and your confident in your shooting abilyties you can take a deer with any cal. good luck!!
Or maybe I will just use a golf club... It is possible to kill a goose with a golf club too.
use what you like its all personal choice anyway even if we dont all agree on each others choices we cant take it personally and put each other down everyone .so if a 223 is legal in your state go for it .as clay says hit mop and you will be fine a 223 will kill a deer to say it will not is just someone who is miss informed or has no shooting abilty with small cailbers or just like the extra power of larger cailber and that not a bad thing eitheir but placemnt is the key with any rifle but a 223 will not have the damage a larger cailber bullet will or the pack out range in my opion .but it will kill a deer if you have the abilty to make good shoots
best of luck this season to all
In GA the hunting regs state " a .22 caliber or larger centerfire with an expanding bullet" or something to that effect.
FWIW, I don't make a practice of hunting with smaller rounds with deer (with some exceptions). I know it's possible. I get chided a lot for using 'them big magnums' and for tearing up meat. I have also NEVER lost one, or had to track one more than 50 feet. That being said, I participated in a doe cull at a friend's place at the end of a season a while back and I did use my .223 AR. And it worked. It worked well in fact. I didn't tear up as much meat and the two I took bang/flopped like Maxwell's Silver Hammer hit 'em. I was sorta impressed. After thinking things through I was right back to the 7mm Rem. Mag and 270 WSM only because some of the places I hunt are potential long shots and if I shoot a creature, I want there to be no suffering, no fight, lights out.
My Dad had shoulder surgery last year right before the season, and any kind of recoil drove him mad from the pain. He was not going to be denied his deer hunting, and borrowed a 22-250. He then had his best deer season yet with most killed, longest shot, and largest buck of our group. Go figure. But he is of the same mindset as me too; He's back to 270 Win and now a 7mm Rem Mag. Same reasoning as me.
So yes it's possible. I have done it. Others(Clay) do it. I am not down on anyone for what caliber choice. I choose to use something that is maybe overkill. If you have something working for you, carry on. Anyone/everyone opining here is telling you their recommendations and what works for them.
I would rather have it(a round with extra a$$) and not need it, than need it and not have it.
It will probably do the job but it is quite risky. I personally wouldn't use it. Go to at least a .243.
State law will mandate if you can use it. Iowa says no.
I have shot several white tail deer with the 223 out to 250 yards. Use a good bullet and with good shot placement in the lung area they drop in there tracks. With the 223 you loose less meat also. A good lung or heart shot the 223 does a wonderful job.
Only if you are really close. Even then, i wouldnt risk it.
WA Mtnhunter: I am not on here very often to know this question get asked a lot. And it's not a dumb question. In fact maybe your dumb for thinking its dumb. And a .223 is all I have. I don't have enough money for a better deer rifle.
Oh, and I think im gonna start using my truck for goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a truck.
See how stupid that sounds?
Why? please answer that. why? Not your best choice.
It'll kill a deer with extremely good shot placement...but I wouldn't use it for deer. As many have already touched upon, a .243 is probably the lowest calibur to be using on deer.
yes,all depends where you put the bullet,i have seen alot of deer taken with 223.
It can take down a deer but you need a damn neer perfect shot with a little bit of luck. I personally wouldn't use one. It is nearly cruelty to animals to use one because there is a HIGH possibility of injuring the animal w/o kill.
I'd use somthing a little bigger. Try a 270 i think its a great gun
I'v taken 2 does with my 220 swift, one ran about 30 yards and the other just fell over dead. Shoot behind the shoulder just like you would with any other gun and you should be just fine. Have fun!
223 or 700 Nitro Express in the boiler room, when the lungs are blown out it doesn't matter! I use regular 55 grain Hornady soft points in my 22-250 and taken deer out to 700 yards with no problem. The only real problem at longer range when I would have preferred my 25-06 was because of wind. Speaking of wind, sure is a lot of it here LOL! 350 yards on a Monster Mule Deer with a 223? NO PROBLEM!
four wheelin
Sorry for the sarcastic response. Read all the posts. You might note that the number of responses likely indicates that it is a controversial issue. If you had asked if a .257 or .308 was adequate for deer, you might have gotten a half dozen replies, all agreeing......
No I dont think its big enough for deer.
O”Here we go again!
A 55 grain soft nose bullet in the lungs will work fantastic and I’ve shot more deer with my 22-250 than all my rifles put together. I get just as much of a blood trail and bang flop with 223 and 22-250 as with a 30-06. When the lungs are turned to mush they are not going any further than if you hit them with a 50 BMG!
From Clays archives of bookmarks, places, information and things to read,
ken.mcloud said it best!
“So, I think that the superior killing power of larger rounds is largely in our heads.(likely testosterone induced) A flat-shooting round that you can accurately place will produce as many if not more "bang-flop" kills as a heavy caliber round.”
jordjohn44
You just might have to use that shovel for some of the BS your hearing, what you think!
packerfan sounds like a "MOP" problem, :)
I think one of you asks this dumb@$$ question once a month just to get a rise.
Go ahead, use a .22 centerfire if your state allows it. Many don't for good reason......it's not a great deer caliber. just listen to all the "if's" with the .223 and then decide. I think I will start carrying my Gamo air rifle goose hunting because it is possible to kill a goose with a .177 air rifle. LOL
If its all you have then use it if it is legal in your state.
no it is not, why because its bullets are designed with wood chucks , coyotes and the like in mind . not white tailed deer . do your self and the deer a favor buy at least a 243.win .
I knew a guy who, back in the 1920's or 30's shot a nice buck with .22 rimfire shorts and killed. He shot it right above the eye from a short distance. It is true that you can cleanly harvest a deer with a .223. However, I would like to have some insurance on my side in the event of not getting an absolutely perfect shot, like you would need with a .223. I would suggest you use at least a .243
A point for cooner. The bullet in factory loads is designed to break up on impact, for smaller game. Even as a military round (and I doubt if your rifle is chambered for the military version), it's intended to inflict disabling wounds, though it will definintely kill.
If it's legal where you are, the only thing you've got (no shotgun?), and you're bent on killing a deer with it, sound's like you already made the decision.
I am reminded of the scene from Into the Wild, where he kills an Alaskan moose with a .22cal semiauto. Took quite a few rounds, and made a lot of hamburger, but eventually the moose stopped walking. I hope your deer doesn't require that much.
I used to have an ar-15 with scope I bought off a buddy. Used it to hunt a few times. Was a great gun. As far as power goes it will kill anything it shoots. Just have to make sure you have a good shot. Not a real accurate gun too far out. I tried to keep it within 50 yards. If your looking to buy a gun go with a 270 or 243! You will have a much better choice of how to hunt and where. The 223 isnt legal everywhere and for everything such as bear, moose, other big game!
Saskatchewan requires min 23 caliber. So as far as I know that means a 243.
It will work, just wont get as big a wound channel as some of the large calibers, so just make sure the shot is well placed.
Yep, I'm just dumb I guess. But I was smart enough to buy the only rifle I had in something a wee bit bigger than .223 Rem. If that's the only rifle you can handle, maybe Clay will invite you to go hunting with him! LOL
hell yea itl work..dont listn to what some are sayin like WA Mtnhunter...sounds to me like he needs to change his attitude..ive seen 22. rimfires kill at least 6 deer in my county.and hey if thats all you can afford go for it...native americans could kill deer with slower loader bows when nowa days we have fast quiet bows.and for WA Mtnhunter you should be quiet man...cummon..we're all hunters and maybe hes just startn out and doesnt have enough for a larger gun..desnt mean you should call eachother stupid..when you first started huntn im sure you didnt know alot about huntn did you..how bout you try to be a lil nicer...and good luck to all yall this year in the woods
sgaredneck
four-wheelin
You are correct, my friend. I did get a little carried away with my sarcastic response. For that I apologize.
I have found a few too many deer wounded with .223 or other small bores rotting in the woods unrecovered by the shooter to keep quiet on the subject. Many states and provinces require a .23 or .24 caliber minimum for deer and larger game - that means a .243 or bigger. That is targeted for the average hunter, not the experienced ones who might use a .22-250 with a Nosler Partition, barnes X, or other good bullet, who might use a FMJ or frangible SP out of ignorance. Plenty of ignorance around too.
This is a volitile issue for sure. However, I am here to tell you that the .223 will kill deer just as dead as any of the other bullets if placed in a kill zone. You do have to use hunting bullets and you do have to hit a vital zone... you do that, your deer is dead. Cripples don't run around because of .223's, they run around because of bad shots. I once chased a gut shot buck for four miles that a turkey hunter blasted with a 30-06.... does that make the 30-06 a bad deer rifle? If you look at statistical results of deer shot in vital areas with a .223 to a 375H&H, you will see almost identical results; all deer being killed and lying within 30-50 yards of impact. I suspect that the reason there is such strong feeling for the .223 is that bolt action hunters might assume that black gun idiots are mindlessly spraying the timbers on full auto to reap a crippled deer or two. Just for an example, my niece's .223 buck at 150 yards last fall was hit in the chest with a facing shot. The 55g hunting bullet penetrated the spine, disintigrated three vertebraes and exited in front of the hind quarters... deer killed instantly... as a matter of fact, I have rarely seen a deer drop faster. I consider the .223 to be just as deadly a rifle as my .375H&H but am aware that the .375 will retain its power after going through two pine trees and the .223 won't. Here in Georgia, a .223 is legal for deer hunting and I would not hesitate to use one except that I will be using my 25-06 for better all around flexibilty considering range and wooded conditions. I certainly think cartriges between 25-06 and 30-06 are more versatile for deer hunting but I have no doubt that if a hunter uses a .223, they can be quite successful as long as they know how to deer hunt similar to any other caliber.
A 270 is better .223 is not legal in many places.
i've heard of neck shots dropping deer in their tracks with a 223 but in my state 243 is legal minimum and i personally wouldn't ethically hunt with it. it matters where you place the bullet not how big it is
Wa Mtnhunter - FWIW,I +1'd you on that last one because I know hidden within your sarcastic wit the message you are really trying to send is " use something that will make a clean ethical kill and don't chance wounding an animal".
There are two schools of thought in play here and folks are adamant about what is working or not working for them. Four-wheelin, I hope the hunting is good for you, and I hope you have excellent results.
Just remember there is wisdom in the counsel of others.
Please don't use a 223. If money is the issue a used NEF handi rifle in 243 or 308 can be had for around 175.00. A 12 or 20 gage shotgun with improved cylinder choke and slugs are a better option than a 223 for deer.
If you are within 100-200 yards. I would suggest you should get something bigger just in case your deer is farther out.
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