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Q:
Antler restrictions to protect 1.5 year-old deer (such as a 3 point on 1 antler restriction)...like 'em? Hate 'em? What's your view?

Question by BioGuy. Uploaded on April 15, 2011

Answers (34)

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from fliphuntr14 wrote 1 year 6 weeks ago

like them makes people think when they are looking at shooting a small deer and a better age structure for a healthier herd. Although some places i guess it drives hunters to eliminate genetically superior animals leaving behind some "bad" genes ( bad from a trophy hunting perspective. Those animals maybe just as healthy as those supporting giant racks in some cases)

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from scratchgolf72 wrote 1 year 6 weeks ago

love'em, ive seen what they have done to some of those PA bucks, i wish they would implement them in MI. the first few years hunting wouldnt be that good but after that i feel alot more big bucks would fall to my arrows and bullets.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jason Hart wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

While I think that it would help protect the younger deer that many people take without thought, my only hangup with the restrictions are for kids who have a chance to take their first buck and he just doesn't make the cut. I know my first buck would not have made the cutoff in many cases, but I do favor them for my own use now. I know where I hunt they have a 4pt per one side minimum for one of your bucks, unless you are hunting in the QDMA zone then both of your bucks have to have a min of 4pts per side. I know that I have seen many people take bigger deer than I have ever seen growing up in the SE because of these basic principles. Like I said before I favor them, but I have a hard time wanting them for youth looking to harbest their first buck.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Treestand wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

At this Point in time, We in Fl.have NO QDM...must be
5" or larger, back in the days in NYS it was 3"(1980s)

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bryan01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Bioguy, you make some good points arguing that antler restrictions don't favor "bad" genes - but I'm not buying the dispersal argument - I'm not quibbling with the distances you cite - but I think your arguments are geared toward QDM practices on a smaller scale such as a large private property or group of properties - not a statewide restriction. Last time I looked at a map, you could run 50 miles in any direction in Pennsylvania and still be likely to remain in the state.

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from PigHunter wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I hate the restrictions for public land. If someone wants to restrict themselves then so be it but it shouldn't be forced on all. How many full head mounts do you really need on the wall? I believe there has been too much of a push and hype about big bucks. Where I hunt it's often difficult to see any deer, much less a large one because most are nocturnal. The whitetail population has exploded and all here are aware of the personal and financial costs associated with car/deer collisions. So, reducing the herd is a valid reason to eliminate restrictions. Besides, the younger ones are more tender to eat.

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from Kenton wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I wouldnt mind the restrictions to let bucks get more size but doubt it will ever happen in Ohio. Here its geared toward population control. With the nice size deer we have in NW OH I was amazed at how many small yearling I saw at the processors last fall. Lots weren't much bigger than a German Shepherd. I wont shoot one that small.

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from seadog wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I'm not really a rack hunter so I would prefer not to have antler restrictions. But I think the restrictions are OK because they allow ordinary hunters who can't afford a high fence "trophy rack store" hunt to have a better chance to take a deer with a big rack. (How's that for a wishy-washy--talkin out of both sides of my mouth--answer?--I could be a politician! LOL).

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from RES1956 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

If you want to grow big bucks, concentrate on the factors you can control. Provide quality habitat and work on the buck to doe ratio and don't worry about genetics B/C that is a variable that you cannot control. Once the buck to doe ratio is good, you will see a more visable rut, meaning that instead of being dragged over six weeks or two months, activity will be condensed to a murch more active 10-14 day period and bucks will be active 24/7 during that period. Make sure the carrying capacity of the habitat is in check too. Overpopulation is a real problem in many instances and this is usually a result of inadequate doe harvest

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from ableskeever wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We just started managed hunting on our ranch, so we'll actually take mostly doe and culls out.

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from ALJoe wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We have a three on the main beam rule in our club. We are also limited to three bucks per person. this makes you think before you pull the trigger. We are having great results in our club with these limitations. Members can shoot all the does they want to for meat. We shoot 15-20 bucks a here and usually 12-15 wind up on someones wall. We believe all deer should be allowed to get some age before we start "culling" bad genetics.

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from ckRich wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Like them. I like to harvest mature deer, and I think that antler restrictions in Oklahoma would give hunters more opportunities at trophy animals. While I am not specifically a trophy hunter, I like to watch young bucks grow into maturity, and cringe when I see young bucks and does harvested. That being said, if antler restrictions were used here in OK, I would like to see the exception made for hunters under a certain age, say 16, and let them harvest any legal animal regardless of age or antler size.

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from country road wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I am more in favor of the restrictions than not. My experience parallels ALJoe's. We find that we are killing just as many bucks and they are all bigger bodied and with bigger racks---what's the downside?

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from AJMcClure wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Not shooting bucks until you can see brow tines on a six point probably leads to less injured animals. Even some 8 points take good light and the right angle to confirm that it is a legal buck. It is definitely helping the "brown down" community kill older bucks whether they like it, or not. I think it paid off big in 2010.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Beekeeper wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

If we are talking about moving a year class forward I'm more in favor of width restrictions than the 4 on a side rule many states employ. This allows many of those basket 8 bucks to get in 2.5 years rather than 1.5 and spread the genetics a little more. It also forces the hunter to look harder at the deer before pulling the trigger.

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from 007 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I'd be in favor of something along that line to allow the bucks to mature a bit.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bryan01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

one of the problems with antler restrictions that I don't hear being mentioned is new hunter recruitment - when someone is just starting, it's a good idea to let them taste success and I think that outweighs the benefits of antler restrictions - I also don't think carving out an exception to the antler restrictions for youths only is good enough - many hunters still pick up the sport at their parent's knee, but many more are starting later in life and wouldn't benefit from an exception limited to youth hunters. Plus, I don't like the idea of trophy hunters cramming their preferred management style down everyone else's throat. You can place my vote on the side of NO antler restrictions.

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from 99explorer wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I tend to agree with country road. After the first few years of fewer small bucks being taken, we would again be taking just as many bucks, but they would be larger in size and would have bigger racks. The downside is the shortage of eligible bucks during the first few years.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from machinegunner wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I have personal restrictions in my own hunting of what I will harvest.

I have restrictions on my land of what I allow to be harvest (private land)

I personally would rather shoot a doe then a young buck.

If a person wants to shoot a spike every year, well I guess that person does what they want, I just do not agree with it.

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from andie wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

i love the idea. i personally wont shoot small bucks, but i know other people who will shoot anything that walks in front of them. i'd rather see them live a few years and get some decent size and mass to their antlers.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from rlowe357 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

In Tn. there is no antler restriction but they have got a 3 buck limit and I think it has helped keep people from shooting the first buck that comes by

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from AJMcClure wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Width restrictions work well with folks that don't have itchy trigger fingers. Basket rack 8's and up are the ones that you really want to see get 4.5 and older.

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from fliphuntr14 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

gman3186- when you get down to the core of management its about a healthy deer herd and making a sustainable harvest for years to come. Antlers are a tool in maintaining age structure and in some cases monitoring the health of the herd.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from upnorthmn wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

gman, i agree if i hunted strictly for antlers id never have any venison in the freezer. bucks are very hard to come by in my neck of the woods. if its brown its down, not to proud to shoot a spike or forky, but each year 1 doe gets wrapped and put in the freezer. nothing like venison chillie to get through these long minnesota winters

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from scratchgolf72 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

as far as the hunter recruitment gos, i know in PA if you are a youth hunter you dont have to abide by the point restrictions, so it actually makes it much easier on the kids to hunt there because they are the only ones that can take a crack at the smaller bucks.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from gman3186 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

fliphuntr14 i agree i like a healthy herd and where i hunt in virginia we got a nice herd i know for the state of virginia was down 24 percent from the previous year but in the tidewater area which is where i hunt was only down 3 percent that isnt a whole lot and the smaller bucks if i dont shoot em the guy down from is so i might as well take him home with me

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from Brittle wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I like em but i think body age has more to do than antlers. I like to protect deer that are 1.5 and 2.5s.

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from Sarge01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

At our camp we have a semi antler restriction. Shoot what you are proud of hanging on the meat pole. Most of our hunters don't like anything less that a wide 6 or above hanging on the pole unless it is one of the older hunters that own the property. Our property is small and we can't manage the deer so our options are limited. We still kill some nice nice deer every year, but we aren't hung up over it.

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from Sarge01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We have enough regulations in the hunting world without imposing alot of regulations and rules of our own. Hunting is supposed to be fun not worrying about violating some club rule or regulation. We have strict rules about not violating state laws and regulations on our club but don't have a bunch of rules that make it hard for a hunter to kill a deer if they want to.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from PigHunter wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I like the way Sarge's hunting group handles regulations and rules. My wife and I quit hunting with my brother and helping him every year with maintaining and planting his deer lease. He has become obsessed with shooting only large antlered deer. We abided by his rule of 8 point or better two years in a row as she passed up what would have been her first two deer (spike and 4-pt). So, this last year I took her hunting on public land and she was able to make her first kill. She thought it was a doe when she shot but on ground check we saw it was a young antlerless buck. At the Christmas family dinner my brother sneered at the telling of the story. But to my wife, taking that little deer will always be a special memory because of all the effort she made to learn to hunt and shoot. To her it will always be a trophy and she's proud to show the photos.

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from 007 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We follow Sarge's idea to a degree, we don't bother spikes unless the hunter is a child who'd be thrilled with it.

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from Keith Costley wrote 1 year 4 weeks ago

I personally don't like antler restrictions. In the state I hunt, a legal deer in antler restriction counties has to have four visible points on one side that is atleast one inch long. I have to pass up several opportunities each year at what are probably legal deer because they are moving through too quickly for me to make an accurate judgement. Some of the deer are difficult to judge even if they are only a few feet away. And, no, I am not blind. The problem is that the deer will not allow me to run up to them with a tape measure so I can count and measure all of their points. Seriously, I have talked to many hunters who shoot first, then check second. If the buck does not meet the antler restriction qualifications, no big deal. They leave it laying and hunt for another buck. Now that is a real shame. That is not what the conservation department wants. And that is not what I want as well.

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from scratchgolf72 wrote 1 year 3 weeks ago

keith, i do see some validity in your arguement, last year in PA i came across a dead buck. a very large 6 point, had 3 long tines but no brows. if it was moving or not looking directly at you you would never had known and though you just bagged a great 8. there was a bullet hole in the deers chest, no doubt the guy that shot it did the "walk on by".

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from Sarge01 wrote 1 year 3 weeks ago

Pighunter,
Life is too short to get stressed out by some antler restriction because we see all of these big bucks on TV that are behind high fences and they want to make us believe they are free ranging and then people think that every piece of property can have bucks like that. Our property is small and our deer travel over two other properties other than ours. I know that I don't have as many buck seasons as I have had and I like to make my own decisions as to what I kill not what someone thinks I should kill. I don't kill the small bucks but they don't have to be a certain size. I haven't killed anything other than a 7 point for 5 years, but if I choose to I can at our camp and everyone wil be happy for me.

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from Treestand wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

At this Point in time, We in Fl.have NO QDM...must be
5" or larger, back in the days in NYS it was 3"(1980s)

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from PigHunter wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I hate the restrictions for public land. If someone wants to restrict themselves then so be it but it shouldn't be forced on all. How many full head mounts do you really need on the wall? I believe there has been too much of a push and hype about big bucks. Where I hunt it's often difficult to see any deer, much less a large one because most are nocturnal. The whitetail population has exploded and all here are aware of the personal and financial costs associated with car/deer collisions. So, reducing the herd is a valid reason to eliminate restrictions. Besides, the younger ones are more tender to eat.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Kenton wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I wouldnt mind the restrictions to let bucks get more size but doubt it will ever happen in Ohio. Here its geared toward population control. With the nice size deer we have in NW OH I was amazed at how many small yearling I saw at the processors last fall. Lots weren't much bigger than a German Shepherd. I wont shoot one that small.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from ckRich wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Like them. I like to harvest mature deer, and I think that antler restrictions in Oklahoma would give hunters more opportunities at trophy animals. While I am not specifically a trophy hunter, I like to watch young bucks grow into maturity, and cringe when I see young bucks and does harvested. That being said, if antler restrictions were used here in OK, I would like to see the exception made for hunters under a certain age, say 16, and let them harvest any legal animal regardless of age or antler size.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Sarge01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We have enough regulations in the hunting world without imposing alot of regulations and rules of our own. Hunting is supposed to be fun not worrying about violating some club rule or regulation. We have strict rules about not violating state laws and regulations on our club but don't have a bunch of rules that make it hard for a hunter to kill a deer if they want to.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from fliphuntr14 wrote 1 year 6 weeks ago

like them makes people think when they are looking at shooting a small deer and a better age structure for a healthier herd. Although some places i guess it drives hunters to eliminate genetically superior animals leaving behind some "bad" genes ( bad from a trophy hunting perspective. Those animals maybe just as healthy as those supporting giant racks in some cases)

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from scratchgolf72 wrote 1 year 6 weeks ago

love'em, ive seen what they have done to some of those PA bucks, i wish they would implement them in MI. the first few years hunting wouldnt be that good but after that i feel alot more big bucks would fall to my arrows and bullets.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jason Hart wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

While I think that it would help protect the younger deer that many people take without thought, my only hangup with the restrictions are for kids who have a chance to take their first buck and he just doesn't make the cut. I know my first buck would not have made the cutoff in many cases, but I do favor them for my own use now. I know where I hunt they have a 4pt per one side minimum for one of your bucks, unless you are hunting in the QDMA zone then both of your bucks have to have a min of 4pts per side. I know that I have seen many people take bigger deer than I have ever seen growing up in the SE because of these basic principles. Like I said before I favor them, but I have a hard time wanting them for youth looking to harbest their first buck.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bryan01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Bioguy, you make some good points arguing that antler restrictions don't favor "bad" genes - but I'm not buying the dispersal argument - I'm not quibbling with the distances you cite - but I think your arguments are geared toward QDM practices on a smaller scale such as a large private property or group of properties - not a statewide restriction. Last time I looked at a map, you could run 50 miles in any direction in Pennsylvania and still be likely to remain in the state.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from seadog wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I'm not really a rack hunter so I would prefer not to have antler restrictions. But I think the restrictions are OK because they allow ordinary hunters who can't afford a high fence "trophy rack store" hunt to have a better chance to take a deer with a big rack. (How's that for a wishy-washy--talkin out of both sides of my mouth--answer?--I could be a politician! LOL).

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from RES1956 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

If you want to grow big bucks, concentrate on the factors you can control. Provide quality habitat and work on the buck to doe ratio and don't worry about genetics B/C that is a variable that you cannot control. Once the buck to doe ratio is good, you will see a more visable rut, meaning that instead of being dragged over six weeks or two months, activity will be condensed to a murch more active 10-14 day period and bucks will be active 24/7 during that period. Make sure the carrying capacity of the habitat is in check too. Overpopulation is a real problem in many instances and this is usually a result of inadequate doe harvest

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from ALJoe wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We have a three on the main beam rule in our club. We are also limited to three bucks per person. this makes you think before you pull the trigger. We are having great results in our club with these limitations. Members can shoot all the does they want to for meat. We shoot 15-20 bucks a here and usually 12-15 wind up on someones wall. We believe all deer should be allowed to get some age before we start "culling" bad genetics.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from country road wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I am more in favor of the restrictions than not. My experience parallels ALJoe's. We find that we are killing just as many bucks and they are all bigger bodied and with bigger racks---what's the downside?

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from AJMcClure wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Not shooting bucks until you can see brow tines on a six point probably leads to less injured animals. Even some 8 points take good light and the right angle to confirm that it is a legal buck. It is definitely helping the "brown down" community kill older bucks whether they like it, or not. I think it paid off big in 2010.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Beekeeper wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

If we are talking about moving a year class forward I'm more in favor of width restrictions than the 4 on a side rule many states employ. This allows many of those basket 8 bucks to get in 2.5 years rather than 1.5 and spread the genetics a little more. It also forces the hunter to look harder at the deer before pulling the trigger.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from 007 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I'd be in favor of something along that line to allow the bucks to mature a bit.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from 99explorer wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I tend to agree with country road. After the first few years of fewer small bucks being taken, we would again be taking just as many bucks, but they would be larger in size and would have bigger racks. The downside is the shortage of eligible bucks during the first few years.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from andie wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

i love the idea. i personally wont shoot small bucks, but i know other people who will shoot anything that walks in front of them. i'd rather see them live a few years and get some decent size and mass to their antlers.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from fliphuntr14 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

gman3186- when you get down to the core of management its about a healthy deer herd and making a sustainable harvest for years to come. Antlers are a tool in maintaining age structure and in some cases monitoring the health of the herd.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from upnorthmn wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

gman, i agree if i hunted strictly for antlers id never have any venison in the freezer. bucks are very hard to come by in my neck of the woods. if its brown its down, not to proud to shoot a spike or forky, but each year 1 doe gets wrapped and put in the freezer. nothing like venison chillie to get through these long minnesota winters

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from scratchgolf72 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

as far as the hunter recruitment gos, i know in PA if you are a youth hunter you dont have to abide by the point restrictions, so it actually makes it much easier on the kids to hunt there because they are the only ones that can take a crack at the smaller bucks.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from gman3186 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

fliphuntr14 i agree i like a healthy herd and where i hunt in virginia we got a nice herd i know for the state of virginia was down 24 percent from the previous year but in the tidewater area which is where i hunt was only down 3 percent that isnt a whole lot and the smaller bucks if i dont shoot em the guy down from is so i might as well take him home with me

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Sarge01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

At our camp we have a semi antler restriction. Shoot what you are proud of hanging on the meat pole. Most of our hunters don't like anything less that a wide 6 or above hanging on the pole unless it is one of the older hunters that own the property. Our property is small and we can't manage the deer so our options are limited. We still kill some nice nice deer every year, but we aren't hung up over it.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from ableskeever wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We just started managed hunting on our ranch, so we'll actually take mostly doe and culls out.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bryan01 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

one of the problems with antler restrictions that I don't hear being mentioned is new hunter recruitment - when someone is just starting, it's a good idea to let them taste success and I think that outweighs the benefits of antler restrictions - I also don't think carving out an exception to the antler restrictions for youths only is good enough - many hunters still pick up the sport at their parent's knee, but many more are starting later in life and wouldn't benefit from an exception limited to youth hunters. Plus, I don't like the idea of trophy hunters cramming their preferred management style down everyone else's throat. You can place my vote on the side of NO antler restrictions.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from machinegunner wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I have personal restrictions in my own hunting of what I will harvest.

I have restrictions on my land of what I allow to be harvest (private land)

I personally would rather shoot a doe then a young buck.

If a person wants to shoot a spike every year, well I guess that person does what they want, I just do not agree with it.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from rlowe357 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

In Tn. there is no antler restriction but they have got a 3 buck limit and I think it has helped keep people from shooting the first buck that comes by

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from AJMcClure wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

Width restrictions work well with folks that don't have itchy trigger fingers. Basket rack 8's and up are the ones that you really want to see get 4.5 and older.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Brittle wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I like em but i think body age has more to do than antlers. I like to protect deer that are 1.5 and 2.5s.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from PigHunter wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

I like the way Sarge's hunting group handles regulations and rules. My wife and I quit hunting with my brother and helping him every year with maintaining and planting his deer lease. He has become obsessed with shooting only large antlered deer. We abided by his rule of 8 point or better two years in a row as she passed up what would have been her first two deer (spike and 4-pt). So, this last year I took her hunting on public land and she was able to make her first kill. She thought it was a doe when she shot but on ground check we saw it was a young antlerless buck. At the Christmas family dinner my brother sneered at the telling of the story. But to my wife, taking that little deer will always be a special memory because of all the effort she made to learn to hunt and shoot. To her it will always be a trophy and she's proud to show the photos.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from 007 wrote 1 year 5 weeks ago

We follow Sarge's idea to a degree, we don't bother spikes unless the hunter is a child who'd be thrilled with it.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Keith Costley wrote 1 year 4 weeks ago

I personally don't like antler restrictions. In the state I hunt, a legal deer in antler restriction counties has to have four visible points on one side that is atleast one inch long. I have to pass up several opportunities each year at what are probably legal deer because they are moving through too quickly for me to make an accurate judgement. Some of the deer are difficult to judge even if they are only a few feet away. And, no, I am not blind. The problem is that the deer will not allow me to run up to them with a tape measure so I can count and measure all of their points. Seriously, I have talked to many hunters who shoot first, then check second. If the buck does not meet the antler restriction qualifications, no big deal. They leave it laying and hunt for another buck. Now that is a real shame. That is not what the conservation department wants. And that is not what I want as well.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from scratchgolf72 wrote 1 year 3 weeks ago

keith, i do see some validity in your arguement, last year in PA i came across a dead buck. a very large 6 point, had 3 long tines but no brows. if it was moving or not looking directly at you you would never had known and though you just bagged a great 8. there was a bullet hole in the deers chest, no doubt the guy that shot it did the "walk on by".

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Sarge01 wrote 1 year 3 weeks ago

Pighunter,
Life is too short to get stressed out by some antler restriction because we see all of these big bucks on TV that are behind high fences and they want to make us believe they are free ranging and then people think that every piece of property can have bucks like that. Our property is small and our deer travel over two other properties other than ours. I know that I don't have as many buck seasons as I have had and I like to make my own decisions as to what I kill not what someone thinks I should kill. I don't kill the small bucks but they don't have to be a certain size. I haven't killed anything other than a 7 point for 5 years, but if I choose to I can at our camp and everyone wil be happy for me.

0 Good Comment? | | Report

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