good call on that one. both have their purposes but the standard cartridges are not close to a magnum. i really have no problem with the recoil of any of my magnums. i could swear my .270 mag kicks more than my .300 mag but i like shooting both.

I agree, but in 90% of situations that you would encounter in the field you have no need for the velocity of a magnum. I have never felt that I am undergunned in any way with my .270 when I sit over a field. I never really considered a magnum when I try to keep my shots to 300 yards or less. I think people think they need a magnum when they see so and so has one, then when they realize it comes with more recoil you have a gun that gets sold very quickly.

I dunno.

According to the Hodgdon reloading info, my .280 has identical performance to the 7 mm Remington Magnum, using identical bullets.

But it's not called a "Magnum."

The 7mm will kill anything that walks or crawls.

Got no problem with the recoil.

I've threatened a couple of times to Ackley my .257 Roberts but it does all I want for whitetails in it's current identity and too it has sentimental value as is. If I want more horses in 1/4 bore, I'll go up to a .25-06 or a .257 Weatherby. I also have a .308 and a .300 Win Mag, different tools for different applications, as so eloquently stated above. Good hunting!

For a long time here in the south if you asked a deer hunter what he shot he would reply, "Seb'um Maaag." Didn't matter if he was hunting in a hardwood stand or on a powerline. I've also seen lots of deer get away wounded and not form the same crew...

I ran across one of those good old "Seb'um Maaag" boys last season. I was astounded to see him with a Browning Micro Hunter cradled in his arm, caliber 7-08. I asked Bubba (that's what we call him) why the change. He began and I quote, "It is light, the ammo is cheap, it kills deer where I can back up to them and most of all, it doesn't kick like a damn mule." He then added, "I guess I finally grew up and realized that big rifle didn't make me a big man."

I don't see near as many belted magnums as I used to in these parts. The ones I do see are used mostly on pastures, crop fields and clear cuts, oh.. and power lines. Most will wear a decent scope now days and are employed so that the extra punch is put to work at over 200 yards. I even know one fella who sits his stand on a big grain field with a .300 Roy and a 30/30 he uses for close work.

I have seen a bunch of .300 Winchesters traded in on .300 WSM's, why? I have my ideas...

I'm not talking down my nose at those who shoot magnum rifle cartridges. If I lived out west I'd probably own a "Seb'um Maaag" myself. For now the only "magnum" I own is a .300 WSM. I like it and have found it accurate. It also adds just enough to my old '06 to do what I need to do at longer ranges or when I need more bullet weight than my 25/06's can toss.

Define performance? If 3 guys line up 300 yards from 3 identical bull elk, one with a .270, one with an '06, one with a .300 RUM, they all shoot simultaneously, the 3 bulls all bolt 30 yards and flop dead. Who had the better performance?

If three guys line up 300 yards from 3 identical bull elk, one with a .270, one with an '06, one with a .300 RUM, and they have to make a bad angle shot that will require some serious penetration, who will have the better performance?

In a perfect world, where there are no variables and all the animals line up for perfect broadside shots while the hunters have all the time in the world to settle down and squeeze off the perfect shot, no there probably wouldn't be a difference in performance. But in the real world, where animals move around and it rains and the wind is blowing and you have 1.896 seconds to make the shot, sometimes things don't work out as planned. And if your shot hits too far back or it has to break through bone or the animal moves right when you pull the trigger, THAT is when the superior performance of a magnum comes into play.

A magnum just makes ethical hunting a little easier in tough situations.

300 yards? I don't think it's the cartridges that have the problem with 300 yards, I think it's the nut behind the rifle.

Hey WAM, sprinkle a little Sildenafil citrate on your barrel, might get a little more range out of it. LOL!

Years ago when I lived in the south a magnum was never necessary. In the plains and in the Rockies I use them often and am thankful for their enhanced performance. In fact my son and I shoot many rifles from .17 to .470, sometimes for fun, sometimes for game, and sometimes you would not agree with our choices. We do what we do because we are proficient, want a challenge, and simply because a certain cartridge is what we consider to be the optimum tool for the job at hand. Insofar as buying a magnum because everyone has one, that's why I bought my first .30-'06 forty years ago. Concerning one magnum I really like and have used successfully for thirty years, the much maligned 7 Rem Mag, there is a story. I forget the gentleman's name but will look it up at some point. Anyway this fellow only had one rifle which was a Rem M-700 in 7 Rem Mag. He managed to place each species of North American game in the B & C with that one rifle except for the great bears. Prudently he borrowed a friend's .340 Wea. for those animals. I admire the guy as I have lots of rifles and no entries in the B & C. Let's see if I had it to do over...

This is WAMs competition, one round 250 yards!

http://www.fieldandstream.com/photos/trophyroom/recent/single?pnid=10013...

THIS IS FUNNY!

Tell me WAM, if your definition of Performance is right, then how come a amny people are kicking the majority of the 300 Mags Butts on the 1000 yard line with a 308/7.62 NATO!

WAM IT'S CALLED SKILL AND COMPETENCE IN YOUR EQUIPMENT AND ESPECIALLY IN YOURSELF!

For those of you having Magection dysfunctions, in the rare event of an Magection lasting more than 4 hours, seek immediate medical help to avoid long-term injury.

libertyfirst

Your 99% correct except overgunned where the flinch factor I've witnessed has caused numerous of wounded game. One of them a beautiful Bullwinkle with a spread as wide as I'm tall with a 460 round right through it! I guess the fella wanted to get its attention first!

Still not sure where the true break between a "standard" and "magnum" round really comes about. It's probably best defined by the marketing departments.

But then there is Hornady/Ruger: .204 Ruger, .375 Ruger, .416 Ruger ... apparently, just your plain old standard rounds. Can't wait to see the magnum versions.

Personally, I just find most rounds interesting ... for one reason or another ... and would love to have the cash and time to try them all.

MLH you bring up an excellent point about marketing. When the 25 WSSM came out, the lowered the velocity of the 25-06 to the same velocity as it. Marketing ploy, you bet!

I would'nt trade my 7mmWBY for nothing, if I was to choose a rifle it would be a 270, 375 or my 7mm. A 7mm Rem mag shoots the same as a 270.

Magnum for the most part is simply the ability of a particular cartridge to deliver massive energy and penetrating ability down range. I believe that that the 270 Winchester is an excellent cartridge and will anchor a lot of game very well but I also believe that the 300 Win. Mag will anchor animals just as well but at longer range and with more energy and penetration. If the shot is long and maybe on the risky side the prudent hunter would choose the cartridge that gives him the best chance of recovery and that would be the Magnum round. I've shot a lot of deer with tiny cartridges, rounds that I know are too small for the task at hand, in very carefully set up situations at very close range on closed property. How often do many of us have this type of opportunity? Most people, I would assume, hunt on public land or permission only property and will take the first best available shot that comes their way. The smaller calibers for this style of hunting may or may not be adequate where the Magnums will offer a better chance for recovery if the shot happens to be marginal. Additional power is never a handicap in my opinion.

DARN YOU'RE A OLD FART!

woodsmanj35, your a HOOT!

Moishe opened up his self up on that one, LOL!

Shane,
That's an idealist viewpoint, but not real life. To paraphrase an example from American Hunter, if I was on a 10 day elk hunt, and day 10 dawned without a single sighting of an elk (it happens), and I was presented with a 200 yard shot with the bull sharply quartering away, and I had a .270, I would not take the shot. If I had a .338 RUM or a .340 Wby, I WOULD take the shot because of the extra punch of those rounds.

Not all of us are fortunate enough to live in elk country, and if you save for 3 years to go on an elk hunt, you're not just going to "eat your tag" because of some flowery ideals. You're going to bring along a gun that can do a damn good job of taking out the animal if it's a tough shot.

Well, Shane, you used an example of the .270 in your first post as somehow being equivalent to the '06 and the .300 RUM on an elk hunt, so that's what I was responding to.

That may be so, but if I have to smash through bone on an elk then I want a big gun. A 30-06 is minimal, a .338 would be a comfortable choice.

I wasn't trying to equate them, just making the point that non-magnums can will and have killed big big game.

I understand that a .338 will allow you to smash through bone but I'm saying you shouldn't have to do that in the first place.

What drives me crazy are the people that buy the magnums and shoot light bullets out of them. HELLO you have the case capasity and the vel the damn thing was made to shoot heavy bullts really fast so do it. Dont buy a 7MMWBY and shoot 110 or 120s shoot 160 or 175s, I know to many guys out here that buy 300Ultra or 300WBYs and shoot 150s because of recoil either shoot 165 or 180s out of it or buy something you can handle. I know one guy with a 30-378 and all he shoots are 150s but with the same amount of powder he can shoot 180s or 200s. I know you guys are gonna bust my nuts for this but its how I feel.

While I don't quite agree with shane that magnum performance is overrated, I have to concede his point that it is used as a crutch by quite a few and encourages the taking of bad shots by many.

clay, you're a piece of work.

either way, magnums have their purpose and if you can't handle one, don't buy one.

"Magnum" and "Belted Magnum" are misnomers. I'll wager there are less than a fist full of cartridges out their that actually NEED the belt!
Bill C. would always say, "The only reason they build magnums is so the Cajuns in south Louisiana can hear noise and feel pain when they pull the trigger!"
I've owned a couple of magnums. I can't think of anything I've killed that a non-magnum would not have killed just as dead or a magnum did something a non-magnum would not have!
The only mag I own now is .22 Mag! It was a hand-me-down! Ammo is expensive.
Fifteen years ago, downsizing a bit, I spent hours in my loading manuals. Found out by and large, my non-magnums handloaded, would perform just as well if not better than magnum factories! The non-mags could achieve near mag performance with lesser powder charges (more shots per pound!). For example:
.270 130gr Sierra BTSP
54 grs of 760 delivers 3004fps in Win configuration
65 grs of 760 delivers 2983fps in Wby configuration
-
63 grs IMR 7828 delivers 2972fps in Win
78 grs IMR 7828 delivers 3332fps in Wby

To each his own. I don't figure I need a "Magnum" anything! Why take a beating if it isn't necessary!?

Bubba

when my dad shot his big 6x6 in Idaho back in the 90's he went for 2 weeks, saw one elk and that was it, he shot it at 500 yards with a .300 win mag. so what your saying is he shouldnt have shot that elk, the elk won that day? i think not....thats why you carry a magnum, if you have the option, always opt for the bigger gun.

and if i went back in time 70 years and handed a hunter of old a .300 win mag he would trash that 30-30 in a heartbeat. just because you wont or arent capable of shooting an animal at long distance does not make me or my father inferior hunters. in fact, i will gaurantee that man is a better than 99.99% of the people on this forum.