Big and heavy is nice when hunting in the thick brush; no doubt. However, hunting out in the open like we see out west, I will take flat shooting speed every time. I could never tolerate having to say good bye to a trophy muley trucking flat out for the horizon at 300 yards. Sorry but the hold over and lead required by a 45-70 makes it all but an impossible shot; it's even a little tricky if they are standing still with such a slow moving hunk of lead. I hear lots of interesting talk of "hunting" them but nine times out of ten, that will be a muley you never see again if you don't plant him quick. I use a measley little 25-06 and have NEVER had trouble with full penetration or blood trail (although blood trail has never meant anything to me because nearly all the time, the deer collapses directly where he was hit) and I am sure that I could expect the same from a 7mm or similar "little" bullet. In thick brush, I have used a .35 Remington and loved it. Where the shots are at 30-50 yards and through the brush, big and slow is hard to beat but I do not consider it universal just because it works well in some situations just as I do not consider the 25-06 universal.

God forbid we limit ourselves to 200 yard shots...

That's what my 350 Rem mag bolt gun does. It pushes a 250 grain Speer hot core bullet 2400 fps. It's a cheap bullet that in this case performs very well.

As I've stated before. I'm from the "Keith"/"Ruark" schools. "Bigger IS better/use enough gun".
In deferance to certain people who love smaller rounds, unless I'm shooting squirel's or pred.'s it will AT LEAST be a .30 cal.
I love a blood trail Ray Charles could show to Stevie Wonder, at least when there is a trail. Most times it's as said before, BANG, FLOP !

Gotta say, I use the ultimate big and slow, a one ounce 12 gauge foster style slug at 1600 fps. Maximum range and I mean Maximum is 75 yards. Have shot close to two dozen deer with this load and have never had one "drop" the most common reaction is a sprint of 50 yards or so, then they stop, look around, stumble, fall down, get back up then fall down for good. Big slugs, going slow make big holes, the tend to "punch" right through everything with little expansion or fragmentation. It is remarkable to see the skinned ribcage of a deer, a 12 bore hole in it you can look through, and very little trauma and hemorrhaging around the hole. I guess the point is that big and slow kills very well, not especially fast, nor is it easy to hit with big and slow, but if you do hit you wont lose your deer.

Golfing Sportsman, this past deer season my stepson and I was deer hunting, he with his 12ga and Hornady Tipped slugs. He shot a very nice buck shot from upper shoulder down thru body that was literally thrown down and not to get up. He was not in a stand the deer was coming uphill.

Of course we are. Many sportsman wont buy a product because it doesnt shoot 500 yards at 3000 fps, even when half or more of there shots are within 200 yards, and most of the other half could be gotten within 200 yards with patience. I think bigger bullets and slightly slowere fps will improve recovery rate graetly, and we will save a ton of money also. Thoses bullets may kill if put int eh vitals, but a bigger slower bullet will kill int eh vitals also and allow you to possibly get a quick follow up shot if needed on slightly wounded game when a smaller load has the deer gone so fast from lack of wound channel we cant even tell for sure if it was a hit or not.

bee keeper

i am glad to hear you love your 338-06 . i am waiting for a barrel blank in 338 to come from mid way as i write this, it is been on back order for what seems like forever now but when it comes in yippy. i got the reamer and the head space gage already . but i cant wait to try out my 338-06 a square ackly improved . she is going to be my new ( mammal hammer )

25-06 with 120 grain Nosler Partitions completely blows the shoulders out but I prefer 100-117 Soft Points. Big and slow may be fine, but the ricochet factor cannot be!

My #1 choice is a HCA 4Runner!

Agreed with DakotaMan and + 1 for you sir!!!