I lose sleep about my rem 722 257 roberts barrel. I know one day it won't shoot like it does now, which is one ragged clover leaf at 100 with federal 120 tp partitions. This rifle is in it's factory wood stock, no glass, no pillars, and the only thing on it that is not factory is the tuned up 3 lb trigger, like glass...

I don't have the heart to rebarrel this old work horse. With all my other rifles I would never hesitate to rebarrel one, most of them are semi customs with aftermarket barrels anyway, that's part of the joy of living in the future- now that it's the year 2000 and we all have jet cars- wait, nevermind, not so... BUT there are smiths everywhere that can spin on great barrels and get you amazing accuracy for a great price. Nothing better than being a rifle freak in todays world. SUB MOA rifles for less than 500 bucks from the factory. Keep those crowns protected and keep em clean!

Dave, if my 39-year-old .22/250 still shot five-shot groups in .650" I wouldn't touch it, let alone get it rebarreled! You certainly are demanding in accuracy expectations.

I thoroughly enjoyed your recent F & S article on "no B.S. accuracy", including your usual dry wit.

It's a scientific "fact" that the lady's have better hand/eye skills than men.
As for the .22-250, with groups like that you want to change barrels? WHY ?

I remember as a kid begging my mom to join in on our 22lr and pellet rifle shooting competitions while out camping, after being out shot by her on multiple occasions I quit asking her to join in. She could go years with out pulling a trigger, then pick up whatever gun and out shoot us all....

Dave,

Having spent a good portion of my Army career training soldiers to shoot I have no doubt you are correct about women shooters.

175rltw

I had a 722 that shot extremely well, but was sold to help finance an elk hunt. Duh.

My current Ruger M-77 and Winchester M-70 .257's shoot Federal 120 gr partitions very well and 100 gr Hornady handloads. My Savage 110, one of the few factory barreled in .257 Roberts, did not shoot the Federal 120 gr partitions particularly well, but shot 100 gr Ballistic Tips into ragged hole groups.

Still looking for another 722.......

When its time to rebarrel you might as well give it up and have another tube put on the action. I had a rifle built about three years ago so chambered that when they were told my load, Douglas Barrels said the barrel might go 500-600 rounds. I have been somewhat careful with the shooting and am at 400 shots. So far so good as the interior of the barrel still looks fine but then maybe it will all go at once. Until then I will continue to enjoy it but maybe next time choose another chambering.
If you look back at some of my postings you will note that for decades I have claimed that especially females who have received no previous firearms training seem to advance at least as quick and usually become more proficient than their male counterparts. This is not always the case but often is true. What is discourageing is that time in the life of a fine you lady when she starts wearing bras and makeup which means they are thinking about boys. At that point often shooting is not so important although it very well may return sometime in their twenties. Just my casual observations.

I shot an old m98 rebarreled in 1947 to 3006 when i was in the youth division of the homeguard. this was oh well 16 years ago and the barrel by then had had some where in bewteen 50-75000 rounds through it.. inside the barrel looked so ragged that the bullet would need a map and compass to find its way out.. but still it shot such close groups that i could nail a skeet as a target if i did my job right at 200 yards.. (this was back when my eyesight was better and it was with original open sights and military stock) so i hunted with it and thought it pretty accurate..

and im afraid i have to admit that my 60 year old mom outshoots me with a pellet gun every time:(
(but not with anything that actually goes bang cos she then closes her eyes and turn her head away:P )
Just hope i get to teach my daughter be4 boy fever sets on:P

I've noticed that women with minimal or no shooting exposure make good students and often outshoot men.
Maybe it's because they didn't play cowboys and indians or cops and robbers. Or more to the point, because they have no pre-conceived ideas on how to do it.
This after 28 years as an Air Force instructor.

(I will say however, they do get a slack-jawed grin after automatic fire !)

Hers David’s proof!

Back in may of 85, had the Colonels teenage Daughter Sandra Worman wanted to shoot High Power. MSgt Mike Woodruff and I started and kept her in small bore. In June 86 she was at the Whittington Center for the Olympic try outs.

Dave what happens to those old barrels? Could yours be rebored in say 250 Savage and would it shoot as well it did as a 22-250?

You are right about the ladies. My daughter became a better shot than her brothers after a minimum amount of time and effort.

Since I've never shot the barrel out of one of my guns, I'll restrict my comment to women. My wife's a pro golfer and as I watch her and other women golfers, there's a marked difference in the deliberation and mechanics of their swing/game, versus men. They stay truer in technique. My 3 daughters all shoot pistol with me and they seem to be naturals. They don't care about exactly how well they do, they just do well. They do listen and put teaching into play. My boys at best, partially do. When my wife had her first opportunity to shoot pistol, darn it all if the only handgun I had with me was my Super Redhawk, 44 mag. So her first exposure was that, and she put a fist-sized group together from 25 yards! Her only naive comment was "are these things all this loud?"
I think women are more patient, "really" willing to learn, and not so bravado-oriented as many of us guys.
Thanks!

All:

Last week I took my daughter's Browning A-Bolt in 22-250 to the gunsmith for a new barrel. I bought the rifle several years ago, used but in excellent shape, and with it came several targets with smaller than 1/2" groups in them (at 100 yards) as proof of accuracy. The rifle has Browning's BOSS ("Ballistic Optimized Shooting System," or something like that) installed on it, which is nothing more than a muzzle brake on the end of the barrel you can rotate and adjust to minimize or eliminate barrel vibrations so as to obtain tighter groups.

(As an aside, the BOSS system works in a healthy barrel; I've gotten groups of around .318" or so on many occasions with that rifle. The system also reduces the 22-250's recoil to that of a .22 rimfire. On the other hand, the BOSS system is nuclear-blast level loud, and it produces tremendous muzzle blast, too, thus pretty much eliminating prone position shots from the ground unless you like a tornado blast of dirt and dust and grit and grass in your face every time you shoot. Double ear protection is vital, and eye protection, too.)

I'm replacing the barrel on the A-Bolt because the rifle will not consistently shoot groups under 1" anymore, but also, and equally importantly (at least to me), the rifle can no longer handle handloads which used to shoot perfectly fine in it, perfectly normal handloads straight out of Nosler's reloading manuals. The bolt now gets stiff after a round is fired and I've blown several primers on loads that once fired and emptied without the slightest problem whatsoever. (I theorize this development is due to throat and chamber erosion, and even though I have scrubbed the barrel with everything and anything several gunshops have been eager to sell me, the problem only gets worse as more rounds are put through the barrel.) Also, and not only with the handloads but also with Remington or Winchester factory rounds that I've chronographed many times, the muzzle velocity of the rifle has dropped 150-200 fps per round on average. (Why this is so, I'm still puzzling over.) So, no more procrastination. New barrel time. (I've ordered a Douglas premium air-gauged barrel, 24".)

In terms of women being better natural shots than men, I concur completely. Although my 14-year old daughter is far more interested in social activities with her pals these days than she is in going to the range (or, sadly, out into the wilds), a couple of weeks ago I managed to get her, a friend of hers, the friend's (beautiful) mom and myself out to the range for a day of shooting. I barely outshot my daughter and her friend. (I practice a lot and my daughter rarely practices at all; her friend had only shot a rifle half a dozen times before in her whole life.) As I was getting into position to take a 300-yard shot at a small water-filled plastic jug with my daughter's .257 Roberts (using handloads, of course), I heard my daughter quietly snicker, whisper, and half-apologize to her friend--I'm not totally deaf yet, though my daughter thinks so--the following: (a)"Don't hold your breath waiting for my dad to take his shot; it takes him forever and a day to get into position and pull the goddam*ed trigger"; and (b) "He's getting old and can't see like he used to. He's probably going to miss the bottle. We're gonna kick his ass out here, you'll see." (Oh, the impertinence and insolence of youth!) I beat them, but not by much. With a little practice, they could outshoot me without much effort at all.

I've taught every woman in my office (past and present) how to shoot pistols and rifles. All of the ladies (but for one who has a tendency to close her eyes just before pulling the trigger) are natural born excellent shooters. I had to work hard to outperform them. I would certainly never want to be downrange of any of them if they were really, really angry.

TWD

My oldest .22-250, a Rem 700BDL "Varmint" purchased in early 1975 (I'm using it in my profile photo) has digested more than 4,400 rounds, 98% of them are handloads that deliver a bit over 3400 fps when they were last chronographed. The rifle is a bit past its prime - I can certainly identify with that - but it's still a varmint-destroyer! I'd say it's a candidate for a Hart, Pac-Nor or Shilen barrel, but I still wouldn't hesitate to take it afield for another coyote trip.

Women, perhaps, may be better intrinsic shots than men, on average. But I tend to believe that men make better use of weapons overall.

Skill does not matter if the intent is lacking.

Dave, I'm all for accuracy but you've mentioned before how we are unnecessarily "sub-moa crazy" these days. I think you must be "king of the ward" -- if there is such a thing.

When my sister lived alone due to her husband's military commitments, my Dad bought her a sweet little S&W revolver -- something akin to the Model 36 but chambered in .32 long. When she was taken out to learn to shoot it, she was gangling and awkward; had to hold her hand over one eye to aim -- but proceeded to drill each can from about 10 yards! After each shot the can would fly but she would still ask, "did I hit it?"

That should, by the way, be .22/250.

I hate to change up the gun as most of my whitetail shots are 15-80 yds with the occasional 200 yarder on a powerline R.O.W but I love busting the occasional coyote at 400 in my hayfield in summer

Dave Petzal, I know you don't need anyone to give you "+'s" or "-'s" since you are already a 5 star general on the F&S website but I gave you a "+" anyway just for being polite.

By BamaHunter "A roof leak that saturated the gun case for months before being found in 2000 rusted the bore terribly."

You leave your guns cased for months on end? Or are you talking gun cabinet?
I left a shotgun cased for a week once and was shocked to see the nice blued barrel had turned to mostly reddish rust, luckily it was light and a good aggressive oil rubdown got it almost back to it's pre cased look. All guns come out of cases as soon as I'm home now.

Sheesh! Things getting rough on this blog. I'm intimidated.

BTW Bella, Women use the left side of the brain, Guys use the the right side.

That's right, We guys use the right side. :-)

davidpetzel,
Your comments of a day or so ago regarding the late Seely Masker, custom riflesmith of benchrest fame, brings back memories. The first time I spoke to him by telephone at his Getzville, NY address he snarled that he didn't make rifles for hunters, they were bad for his reputation. Finally, a couple mutual friends talked him into it. When the rifle. a 300 Win Mag arrived, it was so homely I was somewhat disappointed, but this turned out to be a tremendous advantage. Whenever I shot a great group at the range, or a made a super hit on big game, I got all the credit. No one dreamed a rifle that looked like it did could be that accurate.