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Bourjaily: On Suppressors and Metro Barrels

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February 03, 2010

Bourjaily: On Suppressors and Metro Barrels

By Philip Bourjaily

As the guy in this video points out, suppressors are legal, widely available even, in several European countries.

F&S contributor Tom McIntyre once told me about a trip to Scotland. After stalking all day, he went out with the gamekeeper at night “lamping” (what we call jacklighting) rabbits. As Tom described it, they crept around the edge of town in a Land Rover, shooting rabbits out of people’s front yards with a suppressed rifle. Rabbits are considered vermin in the U.K.

Having never seen anything like this back home, Tom finally asked the keeper: “Is this, you know, legal?”

To which the keeper replied in his thick burr: “Legal? Aye, it’s encouraged!”
Here in the U.S. we can own suppressors in 38 states with the appropriate license. The only suppressed rifle I ever shot was a Browning Auto-22 semiauto. The clank of the bolt snapping shut was louder than the report. You could hear every shot thump into the backstop, too. It was fun to shoot, and very easy on the ears, too.

There is one “suppressor” you can buy over the counter in the US: the Metro barrel. Created by gunwriter L.P. Brezny for stealth crow shooting in the suburbs, the Metro barrel is a ported 36-inch barrel extension that screws into the choke threads of a shotgun barrel. It was sold through Hastings, which recently closed its doors afer taking a beating on the dollar-Euro exchange for its French-made barrels and chokes. Now Brezny is taking orders for them himself at metrogun.com. Because it’s classed as a “barrel extension,” not a “suppressor” the Metro Barrel is nothing more than a three-foot  long choke tube in the eyes of the law.

It works, too. With subsonic ammunition, it makes a 12 gauge sound like a .22 lr. Of all the uses L.P. has told me for his invention, the one I like the best is the group of Louisiana waterfowlers who hunt with Metro Barrels so as not to give away the location of their public duck spots to other hunters.

On the one hand, Metro barrels and suppressors are a good thing because they make hunting and shooting possible where it would otherwise be prohibited due to noise concerns. On the other hand,the concern with such technology is that once it exists, it could be mandated. I would hate to be required by law to have to hang a suppressor on the barrels of any of my shotguns and shoot subsonic ammunition.

Comments (35)

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from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Where's the fun in that?

"Where's the kaboom? There's supposed to be an Earth-shattering kaboom?"

+11 Good Comment? | | Report
from hengst wrote 2 years 1 week ago

I got a little addicted to suppressors when we first got them for our m-4's in Iraq...sure stopped that ringing in the ears when in a building. courtyard, or those narrow streets. I thought about getting one for my 300 wsm ..but i am cheap..still playing with the idea.....as far as a 3 ft. barrel extension I would think a xbow or bow would be better for an urban area and I would hate to use a 5 ft barreld rifle/shotgun

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from MLH wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Nice little comparison video. Any idea how loud the ballistic crack is with supersonic bullets and shot?

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Sneaky wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I would think that the government would be too paranoid about people using suppressors for illegal activities to require them.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from IowaGuy wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Not thrilled about the idea of someone driving by my house shooting into my yard with any gun, silenced or not......

Hengst, you got that right about suppressors for military weapons, I know I lost some hearing from my service, firefights in confined places, the ringing stays with you for while.

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from jim in nc wrote 2 years 6 days ago

so does any US ammo manufacturer make subsonic buckshot loads?

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jere Smith wrote 2 years 6 days ago

CLANDESTINE 12
Silenced Shotgun from Tac Ops
by
Eugene Nielsen
Cover photo by Stan Nielsen

The 12 gauge shotgun can be one of the most versatile and effective tools in the tactical arsenal. Unfortunately, it has two big drawbacks -- it has one heck of a muzzle blast and has an enormous muzzle flash. These drawbacks often outweigh the shotgun's utility in many tactical scenarios.

The blast and flash can be a serious liability. A standard shotgun is hardly a covert tool. When employed for breaching, the sound of the shotgun’s discharge can lead to “they shot first” scenarios. The muzzle flash of a shotgun can significantly impair night vision and give away the operator’s position. The flash can be downright lethal to the operator when operating in explosive environments, such as when raiding clandestine drug laboratories.

The Science of Silence
There are three possible sources of sound from the discharge of any firearm that need to be considered when “silencing” a firearm: the weapon’s muzzle blast; the sonic boom caused by a projectile exceeding the sound barrier; and the sound from the cycling of the firearm’s action.
The muzzle blast is the most significant source of sound. Muzzle blast is the consequence of high-pressure gasses suddenly exiting the barrel. If the pressure is reduced immediately before it exits, the weapon’s report will also be reduced.
There are several ways that pressure reduction can be accomplished. Pressure can be reduced by increasing the volume of space occupied by a given quantity of gasses. It can also be reduced by decreasing the temperature of the gasses and/or delaying the exit of the gasses by creating turbulence and trapping the gasses. The effectiveness of a suppressor in reducing muzzle blast is dependent on how well it achieves these objectives.

Muzzle blast is also reduced by decreasing the velocity of the gasses and either absorbing the sound waves or canceling them by interference with reflected waves coming from the same source. The behavior of sound waves is similar to that of light waives in many respects. As with light waves, sound waves can be reflected, refracted, diffracted and scattered.

Various combinations of components (such as baffles, packing material, mesh, expansion chambers, spiral diffusers, pressure relief ports and wipes) may be employed in a sound suppressor. Artificial environment technology or “wet technology,” as it’s commonly referred to, may also be employed. Wet technology employs greases, oils or other fluids to cool the gasses for more effective sound suppression. The use of wet technology increases the efficiency to size ratio of the suppressor.

A Difficult Task
There have been numerous attempts to silence shotguns and eliminate their muzzle flash. The large bore diameter of the 12 gauge shotgun has been the major impediment to the development of an effective sound suppressor. Conventional sound suppressor designs of a practical size have allowed too much gas to escape to effectively silence the weapon.

A lesser but still significant problem has been the fact that most shotgun loads are supersonic. If a projectile exceeds the speed of sound (about 1,087 feet per second (fps) at sea level), it will “crack” as it passes or the sonic boom is reflected back from a hard object. This miniature sonic boom can be quite loud.

As a result of the problems in effectively silencing a shotgun firing conventional shotgun cartridges, the US Navy decided to try a different approach. In 1967, the Navy announced a requirement for a silent shotgun cartridge that could be fired from unmodified, conventional military shotguns. Although this may have seemed like an impossible task, AAI Corporation did in fact come up with such a cartridge, based on their patented Telecartridge™. Intended for use by Navy SEAL and Marine Recon teams, the Silent Shotgun Shell has to be one of the most unusual cartridges ever developed.

The AAI Silent Shotgun Shell utilized an explosive propellant under a folded, steel Telecartridge cup. When fired, the expanding gasses extended the cup. The payload, consisting of 12 #4 buckshot was expelled by the initial impulse. The sealed Telecartridge cartridge cup contained the gasses, flash and most of the noise.

The Silent Shotgun Shell was a great idea, but it too proved impractical. To prevent the Telecartridge from rupturing, the muzzle velocity of the round had to be reduced to just 450 fps. The low velocity resulted in a short range cartridge of limited lethality. This coupled with the high cost of the rounds caused the project to be dropped after only 200 test rounds were delivered to the US Naval Ordnance Testing Laboratory.

The Clandestine 12 Suppressed Shotgun
Recognizing the tactical need for a sound- and flash- suppressed shotgun, Mike Rescigno, President of Tactical Operations, Incorporated, set out to develop just such a shotgun. While well aware of the failures of others before him, he believed that a practical sound suppressor for shotguns was possible. After four years of extensive research and development, Tac Ops has achieved what has eluded others.
Tac Ops discussed the design of the suppressor in considerable detail on the condition that I not reveal any of the specifics. Suffice it to say that it’s very innovative. The suppressor utilizes an advanced, patent-pending design with proprietary artificial environment technology to provide performance that was previously unattainable. According to Tac Ops, the suppressor will safely handle all commercially loaded 12 gauge ammunition.

Called the Clandestine 12™, the sound suppressor has a stainless steel body and heat-treated aircraft-grade aluminum internal parts. Considering that it’s designed to suppress a 12 gauge shotgun, the suppressor is exceptionally compact. The suppressor measures 10 inches long and has an outside diameter (O.D.) of 2.75 inches.

The suppressor does add a significant amount of weight to the muzzle. The Clandestine 12 suppressor weighs approximately 3.75 pounds. For those who may be concerened about the weight, Tac Ops is currently working on a prototype of a lighter suppressor that is quite revolutionary.
The suppressor is a sealed unit and is designed to be user maintainable. All maintenance requirements are performed without disassembly. Cleaning is by immersion. Petroleum naphtha (safety solvent) is recommended for this purpose.

The Clandestine 12 package is built around the a customized Remington Model 870 shotgun. The Remington 870 is the most widely used police shotgun. As with all of Tac Ops weapon systems, the attention to detail on the Clandestine 12 is superb.

All of the metal parts, except for the bore and chamber are finished in Walter Birdsong’s proprietary mattte NATO Green-T® and Black-T® finish. Birdsong’s finish was developed specifically for use on weapons. It’s highly wear resistant and has excellent corrosion resistance and lubricity. Widely regarded as the best finishish of it’s type, it’s specified by the FBI HRT and numerous government agencies.

The Clandestine 12 is supplied with two barrels: a standard Remington 18-inch cylinder-bore barrel and a 14-inch barrel with the Clandestine 12 sound suppressor permanently attached. The suppressed barrel has a 21-inch overall length. A Wilson Combat ® / Scattergun Technologies magazine extension tube is supplied for the standard barel.

The shotgun has a Speedfeed® polymer buttstock with Tac Ops special non-slip texturing on the grip and a Sure-Fire® Responder® fore-end/weaponlight system. The buttstock and fore-end are finished in green epoxy. The shotgun has a high-visibility fluorescent lime-yellow follower.

The receiver has adjustable MMC ghost-ring sights with a tritium bar and a Tac Star® SideSaddle® shotshell carrier. The standard barrel has a Wilson Combat / Scattergun Technologies front sight with a tritium dot. The suppressor has a tritium dot sight on the top rear end-cap.
The Clandestine 12 will probably see a great deal of use as a breaching tool. When properly employed, a shotgun is an extremely effective breaching tool that can offer a number of advantages over other methods of breaching during dynamic entries. It can do double duty, providing safer and faster tactical forced entries, while remaining effective as a defensive weapon.

Shotgun breaching isn’t limited to just doors. Shotguns can also be employed to breach iron-barred windows, take out sliding glass doors, dislodge the shackles of padlocks, and defeat vehicle door mechanisms with little, if any, collateral damage.

Breaching shotguns need to have have a 3-inch long stand-off device (commonly called a “breacher”) affixed to the muzzle for safety. The stand-off vents muzzle gas pressure. This allows the shotgun to be fired with the muzzle stand-off in direct contact with the jamb or door without any possibility of the barrel or suppressor bursting.

The muzzle cap of the Clandestine 12 has a threaded extension on the front for Tac Ops stand-off. Max Maven of Tac Ops developed a special 2-inch O.D. stainless steel stand-off for the suppressor. It may be quickly un-screwed and removed when not needed, reducing the overall length of the Clandestine 12. The muzzle of the stand-off is serrated to reduce the likelihood of slippage during door contact.

Because of the suppressor, there isn’t any need for for the stand-off to also serve as compensator. There’s absolutely no noticeable recoil or muzzle climb when firing Clandestine 12. The Tac Ops stand-off is ported 180 degrees on the bottom. The ports are quite large and serve only to vent the gasses. The lack of ports on the top of the stand-off is intended to reduce the likelihood of debris from being blown upwards towards the operator during breaching operations.

Chris Billings of Choke™ is developing special subsonic frangible breaching rounds and subsonic buckshot loads specifically for the Clandestine 12. Choke currently manufactures a special 00 buckshot tactical load, the Billings Tactical Buckshot round, that utilizes a patented wad design to substantially reduce pattern size. The company also manufactures a unique 00 Buckshot Precision Bonded round that is designed to offer an alternative to slugs. The Precision Bonded round provides slug-like accuracy with a single entrance hole while retaining the terminal performance of 00 buckshot. S.W.A.T. will be doing an in-depth article on Choke’s shotgun ammunition an upcoming issue.

Testing and Evaluation
Always attempting to provide its readers with information on the latest in tactical technology, S.W.A.T. has kept closely abreast of the development of the Tac Ops Clandestine 12 from the beginning. When Tac Ops begin developing the suppressed shotgun, Mike Rescigno promised S.W.A.T. an “exclusive” as soon as the final prototype was finished. After what seemed like forever, Mike, true to his word, called to say that the Clandestine 12 was ready.

When informed, Editor Denny Hansen said to get on it right away. Having only a little over a week before S.W.A.T.’s editorial deadline, I hastily made arrangements to meet with Mike at the Los Angeles Sheriff’s Department Special Enforcement Bureau (SEB) Special Weapons Team range for a demonstration of the capabilities of the Clandestine 12 and an opportunity to test and evaluate it. The SEB is one of the tactical teams now using the Clandestine 12. Numerous other local, state and federal agencies have also expressed an definite interest in purchasing the Clandestine 12.

Frank and Chris Billings drove all the way down from Salt Lake City, Utah on literally a moments notice, to demonstrate the Choke Tactical and Precision buckshot rounds to the SEB and to test prototype subsonic loads for the Clandestine 12. They brought reloading equipment and a chronograph with them and custom-tailored loads for the Clandestine 12 on the spot. Everyone in attendance was highly impressed with the performance of all of the Choke rounds. All of the buckshot from the Tactical rounds patterned and under 9-inches at 20 yards, staying in the torso of a man-sized silouette. The Precision rounds also worked exactly as advertised.

At the range, the performance of the Clandestine 12 was nothing short of spectacular. Perhaps, unbelievable is a better term. It was hard to believe that we were firing a 12 gauge.

The muzzle sound signature with subsonic ammunition was reduced to a level that approximates that of either a .22 short fired from a rifle or a .22 RWS air rifle! It was simply amazing. The SEB’s Ralph Garay and Bruce Chase remarked that the manual cycling of the 870’s pump action was actually louder that the sound of a subsonic 12 gauge round being fired from the Clandestine 12.

The subsonic loads provided by Choke easily took out a lock during informal breaching tests. Cal Gallegos of the SEB likened the sound made by the Clandestine 12 during breaching tests to that of a rubber mallet hitting the door. I would have to concur.

When supersonic 00 buckshot full loads were fired the sonic “crack” of the buckshot masked the sound signature of the suppressor and was all that was was heard. Even when supersonic loads were employed, a group of SEB personnel who were standing roughly 25 to 30 yards away were unaware that we were shooting the shotgun.

Close to 30 rounds were fired through the Clandestine 12 while at the range. The supressor wasn’t cleaned during testing. No additional artificial environment fluid was added. There wasn’t any noticeable increase in the sound signature. The Clandestine 12 was as quiet at the end as it was at the beginning. Muzzle flash was completely eliminated throughout the testing with all loads. Mike Rescigno called me that evening and stated that the can was still wet inside when he returned to Tac Ops office.

While editorial time constraints prevented as much testing of the Clandestine 12 as I would have liked prior to writing the article, one thing is certain, Tac Ops has a real winner. The Clandestine 12 is certain to see considerable use in the law enforcement and military SpecOps community. Agencies can arrange for a demonstration of this unique weapon by contacting Tac Ops directly.

Special Thanks: The author and S.W.A.T. magazine would like to give special thanks to the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department for all of the courtesies that they have extended. Always striving to better serve the community, the LASD SEB Special Weapons Team is at the forefront of tactics and technology. It’s truly one of our nation’s finest SWAT teams.

SOURCE
Tactical Operations, Inc.
433 North Camden Dr. 4th Fl. #239
Beverly Hills, Ca 90210
Phone 310 275-8797
Fax 323 933-3521

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from spiaailtli wrote 2 years 6 days ago

The guys and Gals in South Dakota hunt with cans on their guns. There are some videos posted on a few websites. They are mostly used for coyote hunting but some use them to hunt deer too.

I'm told you can use them in Texas and a few other states to hunt "non-game" animals.

I agree the law that forbids them is a bit silly. Maybe we should take mufflers off our cars too in case someone might think about using them in some illegal manor.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 6 days ago

The law forbids them because if widely available they get used in crimes. I'd rather the local thugs shooting each other make a loud racket so I know when to hit the ground. And there's no constitutional right to own a silencer.

I don't get the analogy to mufflers. Are you suggesting someone'd spend a lot of effort trying to kill someone with a silenced car?

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jere Smith wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Whats the matter Deihl too much reading for you to comprehend?

-2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Amflyer wrote 2 years 6 days ago

"And there's no constitutional right to own a silencer."

In my opinion, rights do not come from the constitution. The constitution merely states that said rights shall not be ignored nor abridged. Of course this is a Federalist viewpoint and subject to discussion.

"Are you suggesting someone'd spend a lot of effort trying to kill someone with a silenced car?"

I think he makes the point that having a car with a muffler does not change the nature of the car as transportation, but merely makes it more pleasant to use, much as the lawful use of a suppressor.

+5 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Amflyer we agree. My point only being that a law that violates the 2nd Amendment has no force, regardless of whether it's popular or whether the legislature thinks the law has merit. But a silencer is not protected as such under any of the enumerated rights. So if a state legislature sees merit in limiting their ownership, they can.

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jere Smith wrote 2 years 6 days ago

For once we agree Mike.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from focusfront wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Mike Diehl:

That was an awesome demo; the shotgun sounded like an air rifle. But you don't really silence supersonic rounds. You can quiet them down, though. And that'd be valuable.

For openers, the biggest problem I've had as a shooter is losing my hearing. I now use plugs and muffs at the range, but the damage is done. And nobody I know uses both in the field. Most use neither.

Second, silencers are expensive and big. The average hoodlum is not going to stick a coffee can in his pocket to off the Crip who lives across the street, or rob the local 7-11. If they wanted illegal silencers on their illegal guns they'd have them already. So however this works out, odds are you'll still be able to hear the shots well enough to duck.

Third, at least in the east our countryside is now mostly suburbanside. And however cheered we are by the sound, anti-gun suburbanites don't like hearing high brass 12s or .300 magnums going off within two miles of their houses. Makes them show up at county board and/or zoning commission meetings with petitions to close the range.

We have enough guns to last forever; next technological step forward is to make them shootable. Along with noise suppression, let's get Remington or one of the other big boys to develop a recoil suppressed shotgun or rifle. Would our shotguns or rifles look that much worse if we swapped our ugly plastic stocks for ugly plastic stocks with shock absorbers in the butt? Put a legal 'quieter' on the muzzle of such a firearm and the arguments would be over; we could all just get 3 1/2" 12 gauge shotguns and .300 Weatherby rifles, kill everything we point them at even deader than dead, and enjoy shooting them while we're at it. All without waking the neighbor's baby!

+5 Good Comment? | | Report
from jbird wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Who knew Scotland was so cool? Shooting rabbits in the suburbs w/silenced guns? What a shame that in our "free" nation, even suggesting this would be political suicide.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Ralph the Rifleman wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I don't find the use of suppressed ( or silenced) guns in the UK hard to understand; They are trying to make the gun's blast more "politically correct". Most estate shoots cost an arm and leg as it is in the UK, so having the option to silence the gun to me is a question of better communication in the field?? Either way; I prefer our gun ownership rights over a right to own a suppressor.
OH cool video, anyway!

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Clay Cooper wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I shot a pellet into the air, were it landed I wounder where!

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from buckhunter wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I'm not sure I want the local poachers to get ahold of this technology. The report of the rifle is the only time I know they are around.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from jwallen wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I have fired suppressed rifles in Africa and they are a joy to shoot not only for the noise reduction but the design I was shooting reduced the recoil some also. The PHs liked them because it is a lot easier on their ears. One of the rifles they had was a suppressed McMillan Tactical in .300 Win mag. It was an outstanding rig. They make a rifle quiet-er, as to say they still can be heard a good ways off and the crack of a 3000 fps round is still pretty loud. If my hearing gets much worse I may consider getting one for my favorite hunting rifle. If you know what 11 Charlie, charge nine, HE and fire for effect means, then you know where a good portion of the hearing loss in my right ear came from.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Wapiti wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I have to safe, from a weapons handling perspective, I was dodging and ducking in front of my computer monitor as that guy in the video waved those guns around!

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bella wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I lika de big boomers. If one was intend on quietly discharging ones 12 ga though, in the movies I saw the use of the standard 3 liter pop bottle and the ubiquitous duct tape to obtain a degree of sound suppression. I do tend to think this might work about as well as the usual Hollywood special effect does, along with leaving nasty adhesive on yer barrel. It has the virtue of being very cheap to free. I like free.
I however think that suppressors kinda spoil the fun. If I had any need to be sneaky, I might think differently.
However, I have been called "one of the loud people" and at least one of my guns exists solely to make noise, my 27mm cannon (about a 4 gauge)! Who needs firecrackers on the 4th of July? We have artillery!

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from sgaredneck wrote 2 years 6 days ago

With my sideline of playing music, a silencer for me is something of a necessity. If the ears don't work, the musician don't work. I go to great pains with ear protection, but it is wonderful to be able to shoot in the back yard and not hear much more than the action working in the gun. I wish Ga would follow SC's lead on silencer use with hunting.

Mike Diehl,

FYI though, most thugs , being that they lean towards 9mm & .40, wouldn't get a huge benefit - those rounds for the most part tend to be sonic/supersonic. So they don't completely get quelled unless it's true subsonic ammo. Then for the gun to work & cycle correctly it takes some tuning and gunsmith knowhow. Also most pistols require a "Nielsen device" equipped can that helps along the cycling of the auto action. Then on top of that some semi's flat don't function well with a can, due to the reduced energy of the sub ammo. So IMO what you have is the greater majority of thugs doing what they do (unsilenced) and maybe high end criminals with money resources with the stuff that really works. No law is going to stop that. Last time I checked something being against the law hasn't really deterred a lot of criminals. It's against the law to use guns in crimes, right?

focusfront,

Funny you should mention the Remington folks. They indeed see a future in silencers for civilian, military and LE applications. Just last year they purchased Advanced Armament Corp. - one of the largest suppressor makers in the U.S.

Regards,
S Ga

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from sgaredneck wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Mike Diehl,

Forgot to add these thoughts. Back to tha thugs & g's. For them to have silencers, they'd also have to get a gunsmith to get a longer barrel for dat gat and have the appropriate threads cut so the device could be screwed on. Some thug rolling up to a gunsmith's place of business asking for this would be the ultimate in red flags.

The fact that you have walking around knowledge of quotable quotes from Marvin the Martian makes up for the Blondie stuff....LMAO!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 6 days ago

SGa, Marvin the Martian is part of my basic repertoire. That and, on the rare occasion I have multiple meetings backed up outside my office door...

"Youuuure next. Youuure so NEXT!"

We basically agree about thugs and all. I'm just kinda glad they DON'T have access to silencers. But probably it's not a terribly important issue w/ respect to gangbangers, because being flashy and stupid pretty much go with the territory, as far as I can tell.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Zermoid wrote 2 years 5 days ago

A friend tried the soda bottle and duct tape trick, doesn't work in real life. Does however turn a semi auto pistol into a single shot most of the time........

And yes, the tape mess was memorable.......

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Paul Wilke wrote 2 years 5 days ago

In the interests of equality and fairness, since gun can not be silenced, then I think all bows should be equipped with noisemakers.

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from libertyfirst wrote 2 years 5 days ago

I would truly love to have a silenced rifle. I could do all of my target shooting and the lousy just moved in New Jersey import neighbor could kiss my ---! My shooting range has been in constant use for over 45 years and she's been here less than one year and all she knows how to do is collect free money from my state and whine!

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from JohnR wrote 2 years 5 days ago

Suppressors are one of the great non-issues our movie watching (and believing) legislators have made an issue about. If a serious professional thug really wants a suppressor, he/she can get one on the black market.
Where suppressors are legal, you won't find John Q. Criminal sauntering into any sporting goods store to buy one as Mr. Criminal would be incriminating himself since he is already prohibited from said suppressor ownership.
This is another perfect example of how govt. and our less than intelligent legislators attempt to protect us from ourselves. It's not about crime control, it's about control - period! A criminal commits a crime; next thing one knows a law is passed that restricts the freedoms of the rest of us "honest" people. I'm sick and tired of the overworked cliche that the honest always have to pay for the crimes of the dishonest. I say punish the dishonest and leave the rest of us the heck alone.

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from JohnR wrote 2 years 5 days ago

Oh and BTW a suppressor will reduce the chamber throat and barrel life of the suppressed firearm. This should be taken into consideration when comtemplating whether or not to suppress a particular firearm.

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from Dzone03 wrote 2 years 5 days ago

I own a Browning 30-06 with the Boss mussel break. When I shoot at the range every one next to me jumps, curses or moves away from me. It is the loudest rifle ever. The first time I fired it in the woods I took a nice doe, but I forgot to were hearing protecting. My right ear was ringing for two days. I think that using a suppressor would be great for new shooters that might be afraid of the noise.

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from Gunslinger wrote 2 years 4 days ago

I hate this having to sign in each night to blow steam. If you got my Nme, Pass word, why is it equired every night?

As for the zShotgun , rifle, Pistol, an fiearm, just go buy a cheap Lawn Mower and a muffle clamp and attach it to the bbl of your weapon, then no sound to speak of to upset the negihbors or the Cops. You may have to e-make a sight, but thas a easy task. It sre works well on your Neighbs pesty Dog. Go out one night or day with a expert poacher and see the results.

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from Gunslinger wrote 2 years 4 days ago

In addition, it works equally as well if hunting more than one anmal, the slight blast will not alert the other animals you lookig for him.For me to lear this, only cost my companion 2 new headlights and a long stay at the local Saloon to calm his nerves. I told the Idiot, best he not turn on his lights till out of range. I think that put the woees on his night poaching.Not sure who ws moe scared him or me. I sure was glad I had no weapon of my own along.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from JohnR wrote 2 years 3 days ago

One may want to check the state hunting regulations under "manner of taking" of one's home state. I know silencers (suppressors) are prohibited for the taking of game.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Gunslinger wrote 2 years 1 day ago

So few left due the Hawks, Coyotes,Foxes and cover crops, it's slmot impossible find the BunniesW plantabout 1-15 acresof cover crops for the gam,an I oly sw oe bunny in 5 weeks of hunting. Do think te Coyotes gettig them. Rather than spend thousnds, be better off o a bunny hunt.Whne i live, can spot light on my property till 10. All we spotlight for are poaches on our lad and our leased land.Plus i always carry the cheapest gun I if a snotty warden shows up. When I say snot, I mean snotty. The lawn mower muffler does help a lot, can;t tell from which direction shot came from.We ost many nice Bcks to Poaches last year.They only sawed off the hors and one or two bsckstapd, left the ret for ehstevr. Cut the fence in 4 places and stole my ground blinds. Pissed u bed.

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from O Garcia wrote 1 year 52 weeks ago

Bill Heavey wrote an article in the July2007 issue where he discovered that suppressors are the rule in Scotland as it is gentler on the ears of working guides.

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from Gunslinger wrote 1 year 51 weeks ago

This is stupid to have to sign in each time I want to make a comment:Can;t this be dropped. Most of the bettershotguns and some high $ rifles come with a standard Myzzle brake. If they are so terrible, why do the mfgers offer them. I also read that after s shotgun reaches 24" in length, the remainder is waster,right or wrong. I always thought a longr bbl gave long killing range, etc. I have 2-30" Rem shotguns to deerhunt with, full choke and either will kill a runing deer up to 7to 100 yds. I know the bbl length does help with the distance. Many B/P hunter feel 50-75 yds is max for their guns????? Wrong, I killed a l0 pointer at l90 yds this past fall and the year beforer killd one at 270 yds, all are zeroed at 200 yds with Dusk to Dawn Bushnell Scopes. I got a Custom Mauser, a Jewel, but shoots to low at any distance, Do I need to raise the front sight (have rebuilt) to get a zero of 200 yds.Gun is not scopped,and do not plan to scope it. Gun made for a Woman in Spain in 308, I had rechambered to 30-06, (yes a Mistake) but its done now, and I cannot replace the bbl, as it;s ribbed solid 1/4"x l/4"from breech to end of muzzle, with a slide in front sight,with set screw to keep in place. Any advice?

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from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Where's the fun in that?

"Where's the kaboom? There's supposed to be an Earth-shattering kaboom?"

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from Amflyer wrote 2 years 1 week ago

"And there's no constitutional right to own a silencer."

In my opinion, rights do not come from the constitution. The constitution merely states that said rights shall not be ignored nor abridged. Of course this is a Federalist viewpoint and subject to discussion.

"Are you suggesting someone'd spend a lot of effort trying to kill someone with a silenced car?"

I think he makes the point that having a car with a muffler does not change the nature of the car as transportation, but merely makes it more pleasant to use, much as the lawful use of a suppressor.

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from focusfront wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Mike Diehl:

That was an awesome demo; the shotgun sounded like an air rifle. But you don't really silence supersonic rounds. You can quiet them down, though. And that'd be valuable.

For openers, the biggest problem I've had as a shooter is losing my hearing. I now use plugs and muffs at the range, but the damage is done. And nobody I know uses both in the field. Most use neither.

Second, silencers are expensive and big. The average hoodlum is not going to stick a coffee can in his pocket to off the Crip who lives across the street, or rob the local 7-11. If they wanted illegal silencers on their illegal guns they'd have them already. So however this works out, odds are you'll still be able to hear the shots well enough to duck.

Third, at least in the east our countryside is now mostly suburbanside. And however cheered we are by the sound, anti-gun suburbanites don't like hearing high brass 12s or .300 magnums going off within two miles of their houses. Makes them show up at county board and/or zoning commission meetings with petitions to close the range.

We have enough guns to last forever; next technological step forward is to make them shootable. Along with noise suppression, let's get Remington or one of the other big boys to develop a recoil suppressed shotgun or rifle. Would our shotguns or rifles look that much worse if we swapped our ugly plastic stocks for ugly plastic stocks with shock absorbers in the butt? Put a legal 'quieter' on the muzzle of such a firearm and the arguments would be over; we could all just get 3 1/2" 12 gauge shotguns and .300 Weatherby rifles, kill everything we point them at even deader than dead, and enjoy shooting them while we're at it. All without waking the neighbor's baby!

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from IowaGuy wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Not thrilled about the idea of someone driving by my house shooting into my yard with any gun, silenced or not......

Hengst, you got that right about suppressors for military weapons, I know I lost some hearing from my service, firefights in confined places, the ringing stays with you for while.

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from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Amflyer we agree. My point only being that a law that violates the 2nd Amendment has no force, regardless of whether it's popular or whether the legislature thinks the law has merit. But a silencer is not protected as such under any of the enumerated rights. So if a state legislature sees merit in limiting their ownership, they can.

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from JohnR wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Suppressors are one of the great non-issues our movie watching (and believing) legislators have made an issue about. If a serious professional thug really wants a suppressor, he/she can get one on the black market.
Where suppressors are legal, you won't find John Q. Criminal sauntering into any sporting goods store to buy one as Mr. Criminal would be incriminating himself since he is already prohibited from said suppressor ownership.
This is another perfect example of how govt. and our less than intelligent legislators attempt to protect us from ourselves. It's not about crime control, it's about control - period! A criminal commits a crime; next thing one knows a law is passed that restricts the freedoms of the rest of us "honest" people. I'm sick and tired of the overworked cliche that the honest always have to pay for the crimes of the dishonest. I say punish the dishonest and leave the rest of us the heck alone.

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from Sneaky wrote 2 years 1 week ago

I would think that the government would be too paranoid about people using suppressors for illegal activities to require them.

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from Jere Smith wrote 2 years 1 week ago

CLANDESTINE 12
Silenced Shotgun from Tac Ops
by
Eugene Nielsen
Cover photo by Stan Nielsen

The 12 gauge shotgun can be one of the most versatile and effective tools in the tactical arsenal. Unfortunately, it has two big drawbacks -- it has one heck of a muzzle blast and has an enormous muzzle flash. These drawbacks often outweigh the shotgun's utility in many tactical scenarios.

The blast and flash can be a serious liability. A standard shotgun is hardly a covert tool. When employed for breaching, the sound of the shotgun’s discharge can lead to “they shot first” scenarios. The muzzle flash of a shotgun can significantly impair night vision and give away the operator’s position. The flash can be downright lethal to the operator when operating in explosive environments, such as when raiding clandestine drug laboratories.

The Science of Silence
There are three possible sources of sound from the discharge of any firearm that need to be considered when “silencing” a firearm: the weapon’s muzzle blast; the sonic boom caused by a projectile exceeding the sound barrier; and the sound from the cycling of the firearm’s action.
The muzzle blast is the most significant source of sound. Muzzle blast is the consequence of high-pressure gasses suddenly exiting the barrel. If the pressure is reduced immediately before it exits, the weapon’s report will also be reduced.
There are several ways that pressure reduction can be accomplished. Pressure can be reduced by increasing the volume of space occupied by a given quantity of gasses. It can also be reduced by decreasing the temperature of the gasses and/or delaying the exit of the gasses by creating turbulence and trapping the gasses. The effectiveness of a suppressor in reducing muzzle blast is dependent on how well it achieves these objectives.

Muzzle blast is also reduced by decreasing the velocity of the gasses and either absorbing the sound waves or canceling them by interference with reflected waves coming from the same source. The behavior of sound waves is similar to that of light waives in many respects. As with light waves, sound waves can be reflected, refracted, diffracted and scattered.

Various combinations of components (such as baffles, packing material, mesh, expansion chambers, spiral diffusers, pressure relief ports and wipes) may be employed in a sound suppressor. Artificial environment technology or “wet technology,” as it’s commonly referred to, may also be employed. Wet technology employs greases, oils or other fluids to cool the gasses for more effective sound suppression. The use of wet technology increases the efficiency to size ratio of the suppressor.

A Difficult Task
There have been numerous attempts to silence shotguns and eliminate their muzzle flash. The large bore diameter of the 12 gauge shotgun has been the major impediment to the development of an effective sound suppressor. Conventional sound suppressor designs of a practical size have allowed too much gas to escape to effectively silence the weapon.

A lesser but still significant problem has been the fact that most shotgun loads are supersonic. If a projectile exceeds the speed of sound (about 1,087 feet per second (fps) at sea level), it will “crack” as it passes or the sonic boom is reflected back from a hard object. This miniature sonic boom can be quite loud.

As a result of the problems in effectively silencing a shotgun firing conventional shotgun cartridges, the US Navy decided to try a different approach. In 1967, the Navy announced a requirement for a silent shotgun cartridge that could be fired from unmodified, conventional military shotguns. Although this may have seemed like an impossible task, AAI Corporation did in fact come up with such a cartridge, based on their patented Telecartridge™. Intended for use by Navy SEAL and Marine Recon teams, the Silent Shotgun Shell has to be one of the most unusual cartridges ever developed.

The AAI Silent Shotgun Shell utilized an explosive propellant under a folded, steel Telecartridge cup. When fired, the expanding gasses extended the cup. The payload, consisting of 12 #4 buckshot was expelled by the initial impulse. The sealed Telecartridge cartridge cup contained the gasses, flash and most of the noise.

The Silent Shotgun Shell was a great idea, but it too proved impractical. To prevent the Telecartridge from rupturing, the muzzle velocity of the round had to be reduced to just 450 fps. The low velocity resulted in a short range cartridge of limited lethality. This coupled with the high cost of the rounds caused the project to be dropped after only 200 test rounds were delivered to the US Naval Ordnance Testing Laboratory.

The Clandestine 12 Suppressed Shotgun
Recognizing the tactical need for a sound- and flash- suppressed shotgun, Mike Rescigno, President of Tactical Operations, Incorporated, set out to develop just such a shotgun. While well aware of the failures of others before him, he believed that a practical sound suppressor for shotguns was possible. After four years of extensive research and development, Tac Ops has achieved what has eluded others.
Tac Ops discussed the design of the suppressor in considerable detail on the condition that I not reveal any of the specifics. Suffice it to say that it’s very innovative. The suppressor utilizes an advanced, patent-pending design with proprietary artificial environment technology to provide performance that was previously unattainable. According to Tac Ops, the suppressor will safely handle all commercially loaded 12 gauge ammunition.

Called the Clandestine 12™, the sound suppressor has a stainless steel body and heat-treated aircraft-grade aluminum internal parts. Considering that it’s designed to suppress a 12 gauge shotgun, the suppressor is exceptionally compact. The suppressor measures 10 inches long and has an outside diameter (O.D.) of 2.75 inches.

The suppressor does add a significant amount of weight to the muzzle. The Clandestine 12 suppressor weighs approximately 3.75 pounds. For those who may be concerened about the weight, Tac Ops is currently working on a prototype of a lighter suppressor that is quite revolutionary.
The suppressor is a sealed unit and is designed to be user maintainable. All maintenance requirements are performed without disassembly. Cleaning is by immersion. Petroleum naphtha (safety solvent) is recommended for this purpose.

The Clandestine 12 package is built around the a customized Remington Model 870 shotgun. The Remington 870 is the most widely used police shotgun. As with all of Tac Ops weapon systems, the attention to detail on the Clandestine 12 is superb.

All of the metal parts, except for the bore and chamber are finished in Walter Birdsong’s proprietary mattte NATO Green-T® and Black-T® finish. Birdsong’s finish was developed specifically for use on weapons. It’s highly wear resistant and has excellent corrosion resistance and lubricity. Widely regarded as the best finishish of it’s type, it’s specified by the FBI HRT and numerous government agencies.

The Clandestine 12 is supplied with two barrels: a standard Remington 18-inch cylinder-bore barrel and a 14-inch barrel with the Clandestine 12 sound suppressor permanently attached. The suppressed barrel has a 21-inch overall length. A Wilson Combat ® / Scattergun Technologies magazine extension tube is supplied for the standard barel.

The shotgun has a Speedfeed® polymer buttstock with Tac Ops special non-slip texturing on the grip and a Sure-Fire® Responder® fore-end/weaponlight system. The buttstock and fore-end are finished in green epoxy. The shotgun has a high-visibility fluorescent lime-yellow follower.

The receiver has adjustable MMC ghost-ring sights with a tritium bar and a Tac Star® SideSaddle® shotshell carrier. The standard barrel has a Wilson Combat / Scattergun Technologies front sight with a tritium dot. The suppressor has a tritium dot sight on the top rear end-cap.
The Clandestine 12 will probably see a great deal of use as a breaching tool. When properly employed, a shotgun is an extremely effective breaching tool that can offer a number of advantages over other methods of breaching during dynamic entries. It can do double duty, providing safer and faster tactical forced entries, while remaining effective as a defensive weapon.

Shotgun breaching isn’t limited to just doors. Shotguns can also be employed to breach iron-barred windows, take out sliding glass doors, dislodge the shackles of padlocks, and defeat vehicle door mechanisms with little, if any, collateral damage.

Breaching shotguns need to have have a 3-inch long stand-off device (commonly called a “breacher”) affixed to the muzzle for safety. The stand-off vents muzzle gas pressure. This allows the shotgun to be fired with the muzzle stand-off in direct contact with the jamb or door without any possibility of the barrel or suppressor bursting.

The muzzle cap of the Clandestine 12 has a threaded extension on the front for Tac Ops stand-off. Max Maven of Tac Ops developed a special 2-inch O.D. stainless steel stand-off for the suppressor. It may be quickly un-screwed and removed when not needed, reducing the overall length of the Clandestine 12. The muzzle of the stand-off is serrated to reduce the likelihood of slippage during door contact.

Because of the suppressor, there isn’t any need for for the stand-off to also serve as compensator. There’s absolutely no noticeable recoil or muzzle climb when firing Clandestine 12. The Tac Ops stand-off is ported 180 degrees on the bottom. The ports are quite large and serve only to vent the gasses. The lack of ports on the top of the stand-off is intended to reduce the likelihood of debris from being blown upwards towards the operator during breaching operations.

Chris Billings of Choke™ is developing special subsonic frangible breaching rounds and subsonic buckshot loads specifically for the Clandestine 12. Choke currently manufactures a special 00 buckshot tactical load, the Billings Tactical Buckshot round, that utilizes a patented wad design to substantially reduce pattern size. The company also manufactures a unique 00 Buckshot Precision Bonded round that is designed to offer an alternative to slugs. The Precision Bonded round provides slug-like accuracy with a single entrance hole while retaining the terminal performance of 00 buckshot. S.W.A.T. will be doing an in-depth article on Choke’s shotgun ammunition an upcoming issue.

Testing and Evaluation
Always attempting to provide its readers with information on the latest in tactical technology, S.W.A.T. has kept closely abreast of the development of the Tac Ops Clandestine 12 from the beginning. When Tac Ops begin developing the suppressed shotgun, Mike Rescigno promised S.W.A.T. an “exclusive” as soon as the final prototype was finished. After what seemed like forever, Mike, true to his word, called to say that the Clandestine 12 was ready.

When informed, Editor Denny Hansen said to get on it right away. Having only a little over a week before S.W.A.T.’s editorial deadline, I hastily made arrangements to meet with Mike at the Los Angeles Sheriff’s Department Special Enforcement Bureau (SEB) Special Weapons Team range for a demonstration of the capabilities of the Clandestine 12 and an opportunity to test and evaluate it. The SEB is one of the tactical teams now using the Clandestine 12. Numerous other local, state and federal agencies have also expressed an definite interest in purchasing the Clandestine 12.

Frank and Chris Billings drove all the way down from Salt Lake City, Utah on literally a moments notice, to demonstrate the Choke Tactical and Precision buckshot rounds to the SEB and to test prototype subsonic loads for the Clandestine 12. They brought reloading equipment and a chronograph with them and custom-tailored loads for the Clandestine 12 on the spot. Everyone in attendance was highly impressed with the performance of all of the Choke rounds. All of the buckshot from the Tactical rounds patterned and under 9-inches at 20 yards, staying in the torso of a man-sized silouette. The Precision rounds also worked exactly as advertised.

At the range, the performance of the Clandestine 12 was nothing short of spectacular. Perhaps, unbelievable is a better term. It was hard to believe that we were firing a 12 gauge.

The muzzle sound signature with subsonic ammunition was reduced to a level that approximates that of either a .22 short fired from a rifle or a .22 RWS air rifle! It was simply amazing. The SEB’s Ralph Garay and Bruce Chase remarked that the manual cycling of the 870’s pump action was actually louder that the sound of a subsonic 12 gauge round being fired from the Clandestine 12.

The subsonic loads provided by Choke easily took out a lock during informal breaching tests. Cal Gallegos of the SEB likened the sound made by the Clandestine 12 during breaching tests to that of a rubber mallet hitting the door. I would have to concur.

When supersonic 00 buckshot full loads were fired the sonic “crack” of the buckshot masked the sound signature of the suppressor and was all that was was heard. Even when supersonic loads were employed, a group of SEB personnel who were standing roughly 25 to 30 yards away were unaware that we were shooting the shotgun.

Close to 30 rounds were fired through the Clandestine 12 while at the range. The supressor wasn’t cleaned during testing. No additional artificial environment fluid was added. There wasn’t any noticeable increase in the sound signature. The Clandestine 12 was as quiet at the end as it was at the beginning. Muzzle flash was completely eliminated throughout the testing with all loads. Mike Rescigno called me that evening and stated that the can was still wet inside when he returned to Tac Ops office.

While editorial time constraints prevented as much testing of the Clandestine 12 as I would have liked prior to writing the article, one thing is certain, Tac Ops has a real winner. The Clandestine 12 is certain to see considerable use in the law enforcement and military SpecOps community. Agencies can arrange for a demonstration of this unique weapon by contacting Tac Ops directly.

Special Thanks: The author and S.W.A.T. magazine would like to give special thanks to the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department for all of the courtesies that they have extended. Always striving to better serve the community, the LASD SEB Special Weapons Team is at the forefront of tactics and technology. It’s truly one of our nation’s finest SWAT teams.

SOURCE
Tactical Operations, Inc.
433 North Camden Dr. 4th Fl. #239
Beverly Hills, Ca 90210
Phone 310 275-8797
Fax 323 933-3521

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from spiaailtli wrote 2 years 1 week ago

The guys and Gals in South Dakota hunt with cans on their guns. There are some videos posted on a few websites. They are mostly used for coyote hunting but some use them to hunt deer too.

I'm told you can use them in Texas and a few other states to hunt "non-game" animals.

I agree the law that forbids them is a bit silly. Maybe we should take mufflers off our cars too in case someone might think about using them in some illegal manor.

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from jbird wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Who knew Scotland was so cool? Shooting rabbits in the suburbs w/silenced guns? What a shame that in our "free" nation, even suggesting this would be political suicide.

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from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 6 days ago

SGa, Marvin the Martian is part of my basic repertoire. That and, on the rare occasion I have multiple meetings backed up outside my office door...

"Youuuure next. Youuure so NEXT!"

We basically agree about thugs and all. I'm just kinda glad they DON'T have access to silencers. But probably it's not a terribly important issue w/ respect to gangbangers, because being flashy and stupid pretty much go with the territory, as far as I can tell.

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from Zermoid wrote 2 years 6 days ago

A friend tried the soda bottle and duct tape trick, doesn't work in real life. Does however turn a semi auto pistol into a single shot most of the time........

And yes, the tape mess was memorable.......

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from hengst wrote 2 years 1 week ago

I got a little addicted to suppressors when we first got them for our m-4's in Iraq...sure stopped that ringing in the ears when in a building. courtyard, or those narrow streets. I thought about getting one for my 300 wsm ..but i am cheap..still playing with the idea.....as far as a 3 ft. barrel extension I would think a xbow or bow would be better for an urban area and I would hate to use a 5 ft barreld rifle/shotgun

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from MLH wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Nice little comparison video. Any idea how loud the ballistic crack is with supersonic bullets and shot?

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from jim in nc wrote 2 years 1 week ago

so does any US ammo manufacturer make subsonic buckshot loads?

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from Mike Diehl wrote 2 years 1 week ago

The law forbids them because if widely available they get used in crimes. I'd rather the local thugs shooting each other make a loud racket so I know when to hit the ground. And there's no constitutional right to own a silencer.

I don't get the analogy to mufflers. Are you suggesting someone'd spend a lot of effort trying to kill someone with a silenced car?

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from Jere Smith wrote 2 years 1 week ago

For once we agree Mike.

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from Ralph the Rifleman wrote 2 years 1 week ago

I don't find the use of suppressed ( or silenced) guns in the UK hard to understand; They are trying to make the gun's blast more "politically correct". Most estate shoots cost an arm and leg as it is in the UK, so having the option to silence the gun to me is a question of better communication in the field?? Either way; I prefer our gun ownership rights over a right to own a suppressor.
OH cool video, anyway!

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from Clay Cooper wrote 2 years 1 week ago

I shot a pellet into the air, were it landed I wounder where!

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from buckhunter wrote 2 years 1 week ago

I'm not sure I want the local poachers to get ahold of this technology. The report of the rifle is the only time I know they are around.

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from jwallen wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I have fired suppressed rifles in Africa and they are a joy to shoot not only for the noise reduction but the design I was shooting reduced the recoil some also. The PHs liked them because it is a lot easier on their ears. One of the rifles they had was a suppressed McMillan Tactical in .300 Win mag. It was an outstanding rig. They make a rifle quiet-er, as to say they still can be heard a good ways off and the crack of a 3000 fps round is still pretty loud. If my hearing gets much worse I may consider getting one for my favorite hunting rifle. If you know what 11 Charlie, charge nine, HE and fire for effect means, then you know where a good portion of the hearing loss in my right ear came from.

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from Wapiti wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I have to safe, from a weapons handling perspective, I was dodging and ducking in front of my computer monitor as that guy in the video waved those guns around!

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from Bella wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I lika de big boomers. If one was intend on quietly discharging ones 12 ga though, in the movies I saw the use of the standard 3 liter pop bottle and the ubiquitous duct tape to obtain a degree of sound suppression. I do tend to think this might work about as well as the usual Hollywood special effect does, along with leaving nasty adhesive on yer barrel. It has the virtue of being very cheap to free. I like free.
I however think that suppressors kinda spoil the fun. If I had any need to be sneaky, I might think differently.
However, I have been called "one of the loud people" and at least one of my guns exists solely to make noise, my 27mm cannon (about a 4 gauge)! Who needs firecrackers on the 4th of July? We have artillery!

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from sgaredneck wrote 2 years 6 days ago

With my sideline of playing music, a silencer for me is something of a necessity. If the ears don't work, the musician don't work. I go to great pains with ear protection, but it is wonderful to be able to shoot in the back yard and not hear much more than the action working in the gun. I wish Ga would follow SC's lead on silencer use with hunting.

Mike Diehl,

FYI though, most thugs , being that they lean towards 9mm & .40, wouldn't get a huge benefit - those rounds for the most part tend to be sonic/supersonic. So they don't completely get quelled unless it's true subsonic ammo. Then for the gun to work & cycle correctly it takes some tuning and gunsmith knowhow. Also most pistols require a "Nielsen device" equipped can that helps along the cycling of the auto action. Then on top of that some semi's flat don't function well with a can, due to the reduced energy of the sub ammo. So IMO what you have is the greater majority of thugs doing what they do (unsilenced) and maybe high end criminals with money resources with the stuff that really works. No law is going to stop that. Last time I checked something being against the law hasn't really deterred a lot of criminals. It's against the law to use guns in crimes, right?

focusfront,

Funny you should mention the Remington folks. They indeed see a future in silencers for civilian, military and LE applications. Just last year they purchased Advanced Armament Corp. - one of the largest suppressor makers in the U.S.

Regards,
S Ga

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from Paul Wilke wrote 2 years 6 days ago

In the interests of equality and fairness, since gun can not be silenced, then I think all bows should be equipped with noisemakers.

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from libertyfirst wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I would truly love to have a silenced rifle. I could do all of my target shooting and the lousy just moved in New Jersey import neighbor could kiss my ---! My shooting range has been in constant use for over 45 years and she's been here less than one year and all she knows how to do is collect free money from my state and whine!

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from JohnR wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Oh and BTW a suppressor will reduce the chamber throat and barrel life of the suppressed firearm. This should be taken into consideration when comtemplating whether or not to suppress a particular firearm.

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from sgaredneck wrote 2 years 6 days ago

Mike Diehl,

Forgot to add these thoughts. Back to tha thugs & g's. For them to have silencers, they'd also have to get a gunsmith to get a longer barrel for dat gat and have the appropriate threads cut so the device could be screwed on. Some thug rolling up to a gunsmith's place of business asking for this would be the ultimate in red flags.

The fact that you have walking around knowledge of quotable quotes from Marvin the Martian makes up for the Blondie stuff....LMAO!

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from Gunslinger wrote 2 years 2 days ago

So few left due the Hawks, Coyotes,Foxes and cover crops, it's slmot impossible find the BunniesW plantabout 1-15 acresof cover crops for the gam,an I oly sw oe bunny in 5 weeks of hunting. Do think te Coyotes gettig them. Rather than spend thousnds, be better off o a bunny hunt.Whne i live, can spot light on my property till 10. All we spotlight for are poaches on our lad and our leased land.Plus i always carry the cheapest gun I if a snotty warden shows up. When I say snot, I mean snotty. The lawn mower muffler does help a lot, can;t tell from which direction shot came from.We ost many nice Bcks to Poaches last year.They only sawed off the hors and one or two bsckstapd, left the ret for ehstevr. Cut the fence in 4 places and stole my ground blinds. Pissed u bed.

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from Dzone03 wrote 2 years 6 days ago

I own a Browning 30-06 with the Boss mussel break. When I shoot at the range every one next to me jumps, curses or moves away from me. It is the loudest rifle ever. The first time I fired it in the woods I took a nice doe, but I forgot to were hearing protecting. My right ear was ringing for two days. I think that using a suppressor would be great for new shooters that might be afraid of the noise.

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from Gunslinger wrote 2 years 5 days ago

In addition, it works equally as well if hunting more than one anmal, the slight blast will not alert the other animals you lookig for him.For me to lear this, only cost my companion 2 new headlights and a long stay at the local Saloon to calm his nerves. I told the Idiot, best he not turn on his lights till out of range. I think that put the woees on his night poaching.Not sure who ws moe scared him or me. I sure was glad I had no weapon of my own along.

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from JohnR wrote 2 years 3 days ago

One may want to check the state hunting regulations under "manner of taking" of one's home state. I know silencers (suppressors) are prohibited for the taking of game.

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from O Garcia wrote 2 years 3 hours ago

Bill Heavey wrote an article in the July2007 issue where he discovered that suppressors are the rule in Scotland as it is gentler on the ears of working guides.

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from Gunslinger wrote 1 year 52 weeks ago

This is stupid to have to sign in each time I want to make a comment:Can;t this be dropped. Most of the bettershotguns and some high $ rifles come with a standard Myzzle brake. If they are so terrible, why do the mfgers offer them. I also read that after s shotgun reaches 24" in length, the remainder is waster,right or wrong. I always thought a longr bbl gave long killing range, etc. I have 2-30" Rem shotguns to deerhunt with, full choke and either will kill a runing deer up to 7to 100 yds. I know the bbl length does help with the distance. Many B/P hunter feel 50-75 yds is max for their guns????? Wrong, I killed a l0 pointer at l90 yds this past fall and the year beforer killd one at 270 yds, all are zeroed at 200 yds with Dusk to Dawn Bushnell Scopes. I got a Custom Mauser, a Jewel, but shoots to low at any distance, Do I need to raise the front sight (have rebuilt) to get a zero of 200 yds.Gun is not scopped,and do not plan to scope it. Gun made for a Woman in Spain in 308, I had rechambered to 30-06, (yes a Mistake) but its done now, and I cannot replace the bbl, as it;s ribbed solid 1/4"x l/4"from breech to end of muzzle, with a slide in front sight,with set screw to keep in place. Any advice?

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from Gunslinger wrote 2 years 5 days ago

I hate this having to sign in each night to blow steam. If you got my Nme, Pass word, why is it equired every night?

As for the zShotgun , rifle, Pistol, an fiearm, just go buy a cheap Lawn Mower and a muffle clamp and attach it to the bbl of your weapon, then no sound to speak of to upset the negihbors or the Cops. You may have to e-make a sight, but thas a easy task. It sre works well on your Neighbs pesty Dog. Go out one night or day with a expert poacher and see the results.

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from Jere Smith wrote 2 years 1 week ago

Whats the matter Deihl too much reading for you to comprehend?

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