


July 22, 2010
Hurteau: You Vs. PA on Poaching Fines

Last week I asked you what the penalty should be for certain poaching offenses. On average—more or less—you answered as follows:
[1] Jacklighting deer: $1,000 to $5,000 fine; 1- to 5-year license suspension; some of you also mentioned jail time
[2] Killing a deer out of season: $2,000 to $10,000-plus fine; 5- to 10-year license suspension; some jail time
[3] Exceeding the bag limit for deer: same or slightly less than for jacklighting
I told you I would compare your answers to Pennsylvania’s recently updated penalties and here they are. (Sorry buckhunter and walmsley—no “chain gangs” or “death by jacklight.”)
From the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette:
On Friday, Gov. Ed Rendell signed into law a sweeping change in the Pennsylvania Game Code that significantly increases penalties for wildlife poaching…. First-time offenders caught jacklighting a deer, killing a deer…out of season, or exceeding the deer…bag limit face 90 days in jail, a fine of at least $1,000 and a three-year loss of hunting privileges….
The former penalty for shooting a deer at night using a light was $200 to $300.
Your reaction?
Comments (33)
We're good.
I still prefer the chain gang idea, although someone did mention a noose.....
Good change, but it could be even more harsh.
The new penalties sound like they might actually encourage people to follow the rules...especially since the previous fines were less than some people would spend during deer season.
A step in the right direction.
Although "death by jacklight" sounds pretty good, the new penalty seems as if it may help cut down on the poaching.
There's a lot of poaching here in PA. A lot of people are caught, but there's a lot more who never get caught. Maybe the idea of paying out the arse, and spending some time in jail will make a few people think twice. If not, at least the PGC will make some money on the deal.
if to many people make the gamble then the penalty before was not harsh enough good call Penn.
+1 for PA. They should do their jail time on chain gang roadkill patrol.
good change to the law. especially if it reads, "MANDATORY 90 days in jail" and not just "up to".
I think they should add loss of firearm, vehicle and/or other equipment used in breaking the law.
Hurt~
My reaction? Good, I like it and I voted for sweeping changes in wallet hits AND time in the slammer. I was, along with most of my bros' hanging suspension of hunting privileges on these criminals.
Just wait til they spend the first nite at the pen. What will these poachers say to Bubba when he tells them to touch their toes and fess up to just what landed them in the pokey.
Sorry, couldn't resist...
So the former penalty for shooting a deer at night using a light was $200 to $300? That's cheaper than most states nonresident license LOL!
I hunt in Pa. and poaching in our area is a problem. I understand it's hard to deter at 2 a.m. so severe penalties are a good idea
If the poaching is tor the antlers ,then I say hang em from there N**S, BUT,if it was for food for the kids, than a little less punishment.
The change is surely headed in the right direction. Should they be disregarded, there's always room for amendments.
I say great for PA, if the courts will actually sentence anyone to what was written. In MI our laws are pretty good, but our courts never sentence anyone to what is allowed. By the time the defence attorney gets done wheeling and dealing with the prosecutor, and the judge makes his STERN lecture and reduced sentence (insert: only trying to feed his family, recently out of work, was only a quick and poor decision when the deer suddenly appeared out of no where, had "had a few" and was't thinking clearly, etc., etc., etc.), little or no jail time is ever given, and fines are reduced. Only the cost of the animal remains constant. Maybe our courts should take into consideration the size of the poached animal and reduce the cost to the state accordingly?
Don, reminds me of the poaching problem in Alaska for bear bladders and here in the lower 48, deer horns are smuggled overseas to be ground up into a powder for medical purposes
I think this is all disingenuous bullshit.
Call it night deer hunting, slap a license fee on it to get a tag and be done with it.
Dear Nycflyangler,
Perhaps you should improve your knowledge of the definition of hunting before making such statments. It is apparant that you have no grasp on the concept. Following your line of thought I'd like to apply for a permit to electro fish your favorite fly stream. Does that broaden your understanding?
Thanks Clay C. You hit the nail on its head.
I don't condone the taking of game illegally even though some of my friends think that I have a sordid past.
IF SOME ONE KILLS ANY TYPE of game or fish to sell,then fine them big the JAIL.
as a pa residence, I think the new law is great, with already low deer numbers in my area, poachers are the last thing we need... it would be nice to see 70 plus deer in an evening of spotting again.
Good Luck PA, I really hope it works for your state. Keep what I have been saying in mind and see what the actual fines and jail time is given out. You will be able to see who's playing politics with you wildlife funds.
Beekeeper,
You're missing the point. Hunting comes down to finding, killing one animal and then eating it. If you'd want to fill your tag by walking through the woods at night with a flashlight, or chasing down a deer with nothing but a knife, that's okay too.
Deer are largely nocturnal. So hunting them when they're out and about, is the most logical way to do so.
What your suggesting with electrofishing is more akin to dropping a cluster bomb on a herd from a plane and killing several animals at once.
Well put Beekeeper, +1 for you Sir!
I've been through Pa enough to be a resident of the State. Not only Beekeeper put it best, I would also charge the individuals shooting at night with reckless endangerment and bury them under the jail! Some people have no idea what places people live, even when they live in the area!!!
IDIOTS!
Reminds me of those shooting road signs and right in the line of fire is a house!
Nycflyangler, you scare the hell out of me!
country road I'm pretty sure they do take firearms and other equipment.(not sure about vehicle's though) Ncflyangler Hunting is much more than finding,killing and eating. what about ethics,sportsmanship and respect for the animal you hunt! Not to mention how dangerous the first day of deer season would be if it started at midnight! GET REAL!!!
NYCflyangler,
Ah... you fancy yourself to be some sort of intellectual. Save your stilted whit for your cocktail party friends who no doubt are impressed by your half baked banter as they posess even less knowledge than you do.
On one hand, we have people here talking about how deer are wreaking havoc because they're over populated and causing highway accidents, damage to agriculture and landscaping. There's 130 hits when you search 'deer overpopulation'.
On the other hand, we have people applauding penalizing the people actually doing something about the over population problem, allbeit illegally.
SO WHICH IS IT? You're talking out both sides of your mouth.
Beekeeper, try taking your head out of your ass. I know it probably hurts from falling out of the top of the stupid tree and hitting it on every branch on the way down so often. But what you're doing isn't an effective tratment plan.
Nycflyangler Poachers are not performing some sort of community service they are thieves and in most cases tresspassers when they get caught they deserve what they get. Also no one is talking out both sides of their mouths. The problem isn't deer overpopulation it's urban sprawl people building homes and developments in the country where deer live. This land can no longer be hunted but the deer still live their. These people wish to escape the lights and noise of the city but in many cases they bring it with them they talk on their cell phones or worse yet tex while driving. Then when these distracted drivers hit a deer it's the deer's fault? I know Beekeeper dosen't need me to speak for them but I think you are the one with your head up your a**!
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Pa deer hunter wrote:
"Poachers are not performing some sort of community service they are thieves and in most cases tresspassers(SIC) when they get caught they deserve what they get."
How are they doing anything different then the professional exterminators the municipalities hire to come in and kill off the nuisance deer?
Oh yeah, they're doing it for free so you and I don't have to pay for it. Free is good.
"The problem isn't deer overpopulation it's urban sprawl people building homes and developments in the country where deer live. This land can no longer be hunted but the deer still live their(SIC)."
If people live there, then there's really not room for the deer to be there as well. If the deer population won't move, then they're over populated and need to be dealt with.
"Then when these distracted drivers hit a deer it's the deer's fault?"
No, but deer don't vote, so they're screwed. Deer are very good at appearing out of nowhere, so it's more than being distracted. People getting killed in deer related accidents are just as dead as people who are stalked and killed by coyotes. So the deer are overpopulated for the living space they have and need to be thinned.
Now obviously the poachers are technically committing a crime. However, since the government instead of opening legitimate hunting for these nuisance deer, are pandering to the anti-hunting crowd.
The poachers are doing what the government doesn't have the guts to do, defy PETA & Co's wishes.
They're no different than someone who goes out and picks up garbage off the side of the road. It's the government's job to do so, but they're not doing it.
All you people complaining about the poachers are is being PETA & Co's bitches. Congratulations! You're now a PETA spokesperson.
"I know Beekeeper dosen't(SIC) need me to speak for them but I think you are the one with your head up your a**!"
You both need remedial work in basic logic and critical thinking, as well as a doctor to extract your head from your respective anal canals.
"Also no one is talking out both sides of their mouths."
Your post proved that most people here are talking out of both sides of their mouths.
Post a Comment
Good change, but it could be even more harsh.
Dear Nycflyangler,
Perhaps you should improve your knowledge of the definition of hunting before making such statments. It is apparant that you have no grasp on the concept. Following your line of thought I'd like to apply for a permit to electro fish your favorite fly stream. Does that broaden your understanding?
We're good.
I still prefer the chain gang idea, although someone did mention a noose.....
Although "death by jacklight" sounds pretty good, the new penalty seems as if it may help cut down on the poaching.
There's a lot of poaching here in PA. A lot of people are caught, but there's a lot more who never get caught. Maybe the idea of paying out the arse, and spending some time in jail will make a few people think twice. If not, at least the PGC will make some money on the deal.
good change to the law. especially if it reads, "MANDATORY 90 days in jail" and not just "up to".
Well put Beekeeper, +1 for you Sir!
I've been through Pa enough to be a resident of the State. Not only Beekeeper put it best, I would also charge the individuals shooting at night with reckless endangerment and bury them under the jail! Some people have no idea what places people live, even when they live in the area!!!
IDIOTS!
Reminds me of those shooting road signs and right in the line of fire is a house!
The new penalties sound like they might actually encourage people to follow the rules...especially since the previous fines were less than some people would spend during deer season.
A step in the right direction.
if to many people make the gamble then the penalty before was not harsh enough good call Penn.
+1 for PA. They should do their jail time on chain gang roadkill patrol.
I think they should add loss of firearm, vehicle and/or other equipment used in breaking the law.
Hurt~
My reaction? Good, I like it and I voted for sweeping changes in wallet hits AND time in the slammer. I was, along with most of my bros' hanging suspension of hunting privileges on these criminals.
Just wait til they spend the first nite at the pen. What will these poachers say to Bubba when he tells them to touch their toes and fess up to just what landed them in the pokey.
Sorry, couldn't resist...
I hunt in Pa. and poaching in our area is a problem. I understand it's hard to deter at 2 a.m. so severe penalties are a good idea
I say great for PA, if the courts will actually sentence anyone to what was written. In MI our laws are pretty good, but our courts never sentence anyone to what is allowed. By the time the defence attorney gets done wheeling and dealing with the prosecutor, and the judge makes his STERN lecture and reduced sentence (insert: only trying to feed his family, recently out of work, was only a quick and poor decision when the deer suddenly appeared out of no where, had "had a few" and was't thinking clearly, etc., etc., etc.), little or no jail time is ever given, and fines are reduced. Only the cost of the animal remains constant. Maybe our courts should take into consideration the size of the poached animal and reduce the cost to the state accordingly?
Nycflyangler, you scare the hell out of me!
So the former penalty for shooting a deer at night using a light was $200 to $300? That's cheaper than most states nonresident license LOL!
If the poaching is tor the antlers ,then I say hang em from there N**S, BUT,if it was for food for the kids, than a little less punishment.
The change is surely headed in the right direction. Should they be disregarded, there's always room for amendments.
Don, reminds me of the poaching problem in Alaska for bear bladders and here in the lower 48, deer horns are smuggled overseas to be ground up into a powder for medical purposes
Thanks Clay C. You hit the nail on its head.
I don't condone the taking of game illegally even though some of my friends think that I have a sordid past.
IF SOME ONE KILLS ANY TYPE of game or fish to sell,then fine them big the JAIL.
as a pa residence, I think the new law is great, with already low deer numbers in my area, poachers are the last thing we need... it would be nice to see 70 plus deer in an evening of spotting again.
Good Luck PA, I really hope it works for your state. Keep what I have been saying in mind and see what the actual fines and jail time is given out. You will be able to see who's playing politics with you wildlife funds.
country road I'm pretty sure they do take firearms and other equipment.(not sure about vehicle's though) Ncflyangler Hunting is much more than finding,killing and eating. what about ethics,sportsmanship and respect for the animal you hunt! Not to mention how dangerous the first day of deer season would be if it started at midnight! GET REAL!!!
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NYCflyangler,
Ah... you fancy yourself to be some sort of intellectual. Save your stilted whit for your cocktail party friends who no doubt are impressed by your half baked banter as they posess even less knowledge than you do.
On one hand, we have people here talking about how deer are wreaking havoc because they're over populated and causing highway accidents, damage to agriculture and landscaping. There's 130 hits when you search 'deer overpopulation'.
On the other hand, we have people applauding penalizing the people actually doing something about the over population problem, allbeit illegally.
SO WHICH IS IT? You're talking out both sides of your mouth.
Beekeeper, try taking your head out of your ass. I know it probably hurts from falling out of the top of the stupid tree and hitting it on every branch on the way down so often. But what you're doing isn't an effective tratment plan.
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Nycflyangler Poachers are not performing some sort of community service they are thieves and in most cases tresspassers when they get caught they deserve what they get. Also no one is talking out both sides of their mouths. The problem isn't deer overpopulation it's urban sprawl people building homes and developments in the country where deer live. This land can no longer be hunted but the deer still live their. These people wish to escape the lights and noise of the city but in many cases they bring it with them they talk on their cell phones or worse yet tex while driving. Then when these distracted drivers hit a deer it's the deer's fault? I know Beekeeper dosen't need me to speak for them but I think you are the one with your head up your a**!
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Pa deer hunter wrote:
"Poachers are not performing some sort of community service they are thieves and in most cases tresspassers(SIC) when they get caught they deserve what they get."
How are they doing anything different then the professional exterminators the municipalities hire to come in and kill off the nuisance deer?
Oh yeah, they're doing it for free so you and I don't have to pay for it. Free is good.
"The problem isn't deer overpopulation it's urban sprawl people building homes and developments in the country where deer live. This land can no longer be hunted but the deer still live their(SIC)."
If people live there, then there's really not room for the deer to be there as well. If the deer population won't move, then they're over populated and need to be dealt with.
"Then when these distracted drivers hit a deer it's the deer's fault?"
No, but deer don't vote, so they're screwed. Deer are very good at appearing out of nowhere, so it's more than being distracted. People getting killed in deer related accidents are just as dead as people who are stalked and killed by coyotes. So the deer are overpopulated for the living space they have and need to be thinned.
Now obviously the poachers are technically committing a crime. However, since the government instead of opening legitimate hunting for these nuisance deer, are pandering to the anti-hunting crowd.
The poachers are doing what the government doesn't have the guts to do, defy PETA & Co's wishes.
They're no different than someone who goes out and picks up garbage off the side of the road. It's the government's job to do so, but they're not doing it.
All you people complaining about the poachers are is being PETA & Co's bitches. Congratulations! You're now a PETA spokesperson.
"I know Beekeeper dosen't(SIC) need me to speak for them but I think you are the one with your head up your a**!"
You both need remedial work in basic logic and critical thinking, as well as a doctor to extract your head from your respective anal canals.
"Also no one is talking out both sides of their mouths."
Your post proved that most people here are talking out of both sides of their mouths.
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Beekeeper,
You're missing the point. Hunting comes down to finding, killing one animal and then eating it. If you'd want to fill your tag by walking through the woods at night with a flashlight, or chasing down a deer with nothing but a knife, that's okay too.
Deer are largely nocturnal. So hunting them when they're out and about, is the most logical way to do so.
What your suggesting with electrofishing is more akin to dropping a cluster bomb on a herd from a plane and killing several animals at once.
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I think this is all disingenuous bullshit.
Call it night deer hunting, slap a license fee on it to get a tag and be done with it.
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