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Alleged Murder by 10-year-old Sparks Debate in Ohio Town About Youth Access To Firearms

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January 10, 2011

Alleged Murder by 10-year-old Sparks Debate in Ohio Town About Youth Access To Firearms

--Dave Maccar

An apparent instance of matricide in the Ohio hunting town of Big Prarie has sparked a debate over whether children should have access to firearms.

From this Associated Press story via WKBN.com:
A 10-year-old boy who kept guns in his Ohio bedroom and now is accused of killing his mother has stirred up debate over whether children should have access to weapons. Authorities say the boy picked up a rifle and shot 46-year-old Deborah McVay after an argument over chores.

The boy's age has exposed the divide between rural and urban in a nation where 80 million people are registered gun owners.

Children in northeast Ohio's Big Prairie learn to fire guns as easily as they would learn to ride a bicycle. Residents say guns are a part of life and McVay's death was a parenting issue.

Psychologists caution that a 10-year-old can't comprehend the long-term consequences of using a gun to harm another person.

So what do you think? Is a 10-year-old emotionally mature enough to understand the consequences of using a firearm, or is it like the psychologists say? Does this have less to do with young hunters having access to firearms and more to do with an obviously abnormal home life?

Comments (17)

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from bowhuntermike wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

a sad story all over chores. i believe that all guns should be kept in a secure location that only a parent or a gaurdian can have acess to. A 10 year olds emotions can get the better of them when there frustrated or upset, this is why no 10 year old no mater how mature the parent thinks they are shouldnt have a gun they have immediate access too.

+8 Good Comment? | | Report
from jcarlin wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I just don't know. I have no problem with young kids learning to hunt and shoot young with adult supervision. I do think a kid younger than 13 or 14 may have a harder time with consequences and are more likely to do something in the heat of the moment that they'll regret becuase of that lack of perspective. I think the 'supervised' portion of this topic is where I have my hang-ups. I'm sure there are kids who are perfectly responsible and can handle having a firearm in their room and solely under their discretion. They may even be in the majority. I don't know that I think it's a great idea as kids are kids. They tend to be more impulsive, more rash, and have less of a sense of proportion about the ills they perceive. I'm not going to argue that adults can be subject to all of the above, we all know the type. I think little Johny or Susie can own a gun, but I generally think an adult should be in possession of it until it's time to use it. This does open a self-defense argument that I'm not sure I can square this view with.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from pbshooter1217 wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

It sounds like poor parenting to me. I don't have a problem with teenagers having guns if they were taught to use them correctly and how to be responsible with them. At 10, I think the parent should keep the gun in a safe place.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Dcast wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

Guns are not toys. No kid should have access to a gun even if you feel they are mature enough. Maturity has nothing to do with whether or not a child and even teenagers are able to have access to a gun. Kids and teenagers do not have the mentality to have access to guns, they react on emotions and often times don't think of the consequences of their actions until after the fact. With age comes wisdom, rationality, and then responsibility, you need the 1st two before the 3rd requirement to have a gun at your disposal and as far as I'm concerned 18yrs old MINIMUM would be the age requirement for someone to have easy access to a gun, and will be in my house. This was a serious lack of responsibility on the parents part and unfortunately they had to pay the price with the loss of a life. This shows also being an adult doesn't automatically mean you should have access to a gun because these people clearly dropped the ball on wisdom, rationality, and responsibility.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from mad_dog9999 wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

Thats what gun cabinets and safes are for. Lock up your guns when not in use. And keep the key out of reach or hidden in a safe spot.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I believe the guns should be locked up and secure. A 10-year-old should not have easy access to them. I believe if there a guns in the home, a 10-year-old should have had extensive training in how to use a gun and the results of shooting a gun.

However, that is a family issue, and not something to be determines or set in law by any level of government.

Also, please remember that this is not a gun issue. Any 10-year-old who would be willing to shoot his own (?) mother because of a disagreement over chores would just have easily clubbed her with a baseball-bat or stabbed her with a knife. A gun, I'll admit is more convenient and more lethal, but the problem is the kid, not the guns.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from steve182 wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

A 10 year old may be mature enough to shoot guns and/or go hunting, but he or she is not mature enough to own or possess guns. No way. They should always be locked and unloaded when not in use. a possible exception is a bb gun, but even those require adult supervision at that age. Very sad story. C'mon people, lock'em up.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from wgiles wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

At that age, no. I was that age 50 years ago. I got my first rifle when I was 12, but I was only allowed to shoot it under my father's supervision. The rest of the time, it was locked up with the rest of the firearms. These days, I would probably not allow free access to firearms until the child was of legal age to own it and had all of the required training and documents. In Illinois, we have to have a Firearms Owner's ID card.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mike Plotner wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

i heard about that the kid had 1 rifle and 3 shotguns. i keep my guns in my room. they are in a locked cabnit except for a .22 single shot wich i use for coon hunting that is in my closet. and my little brother and sister know that me mom and dad are the only ones alowed to handel them unless one of us is around. the ammo is also locked up so thats a plus.when i was ten i had a bb gun and i chould shoot dads .22 but they were in my parents room. i think he should have just had a bb gun at ten unless the guns are kept in a parents room

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bella wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

While I'm very into teaching kids to shoot, 10 years old it too young for a kid to have free access to firearms and ammo. While this sounds rather deliberate, too many kids die "playing" with firearms left unsecured by adults.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from kansasjeff wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I've often wondered about the appropriate age for a first gun. For me my Grandpa began teaching me to shoot when I was 10 (.22 rifle that he kept locked up in his gun cabinet and I was NOT allowed to touch it unless he or my Grandma were teaching me) also he began teaching me to hunt at the same time. At 12 I was given a BB gun that I could use around the woods near their farm. (Also kept locked in the gun cabinet and I had to ask permission to take it out.) For Christmas when I was 15 I was giving a 20 gauge shotgun to hunt rabbits and birds alongside my grandpa. (Again same rules applied as with the BB gun.)

When I tell some people this they are shocked that I had access to firearms at such a young age. Other people tell me they had their first gun much younger. It’s clear to me that NO parent should let their child have easy and unsupervised access to a gun.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from lamson yankee wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

The young boy did the crime,not the gun.I watched this story on the news last week and obviously there was much more to the story.The bottom line always rests with the parents! This boy has many "self" issues which were not addressed by the family sadly as it is......

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from ricefarm wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I was 12 when I got my first shotgun. Like many of you when I started driving I sometimes had it in my trunk, as did many of my friends. The only case I knew of where a kid shot someone was a boy protecting his mom from a very abusive dad. It simply never would have occured to any of us to shoot someone to settle anything. I don't know if you blame violence on tv, video games or what but it's obvious some of these kids today are exposed to something that gives them a very casual attitude about killing, but don't try to tell me the problem is access to guns.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from FirstBubba wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

The first time my kids asked me about guns in general, they were introduced to everything I owned at the time. They were allowed to shoot .22's ad nauseam. They were constantly reminded that firearms kill humans as well as game animals. Their mother assisted in this training and helped reinforce that guns are deadly when handled wrong, but perfectly safe when handled correctly. Both my children ended up in law enforcement. I'm VERY proud of them both.
They have both been handling guns since age 4 or 5. Both have had open access to every arm in the house from that point forward. Some kids can handle the responsibility just fine at age 10, some can't.

Bubba

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from greyhunter wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

Because of the decline of hunters numbers in Pa. The state and many hunter groups are pushing mentored hunting. Some parents evidently feel this means it is now safe to leave a 10 year old complete access to arms and ammunition. They may be able to pull the trigger when a firearm is held for them on game, but they lack maturity and judgement. Would you leave the car keys with them? Too bad the mother didn't act on her fears and remove the damn guns in spite of his protests. Who is in charge, children or parents?

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Wmorris wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I was introduced to guns and hunting by my father way before I was even big enough to carry a .22 rifle. He kept his guns secured however. I raised two children and introduced them to weapons and hunting also at a young age. They were really impressed with was my .357 and 9 mm did to a milk carton full of water but they also appreciated what they could do to a human body. I trusted my children by kept my weapons secured. I think it is normal to introduce children to weapons at a young age, but they must be kept secured! A fatal mistake whether by accident or on purpose. We must teach young people responsibility and consequences whether it be with weapons or life in general. Just another reason for the anti's to rant against guns and hunting.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from smallgamehunter25 wrote 1 year 18 weeks ago

I think that as long as theres no ammo in the possesion of the child or some that they can get to they should be able to have guns in their room, because without ammo whats gonna happen? I'm 16 and have my guns on my wall on the gunrack I made in woodworking and I think they make the room look nice, just sayin.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report

Post a Comment

from bowhuntermike wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

a sad story all over chores. i believe that all guns should be kept in a secure location that only a parent or a gaurdian can have acess to. A 10 year olds emotions can get the better of them when there frustrated or upset, this is why no 10 year old no mater how mature the parent thinks they are shouldnt have a gun they have immediate access too.

+8 Good Comment? | | Report
from pbshooter1217 wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

It sounds like poor parenting to me. I don't have a problem with teenagers having guns if they were taught to use them correctly and how to be responsible with them. At 10, I think the parent should keep the gun in a safe place.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from jcarlin wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I just don't know. I have no problem with young kids learning to hunt and shoot young with adult supervision. I do think a kid younger than 13 or 14 may have a harder time with consequences and are more likely to do something in the heat of the moment that they'll regret becuase of that lack of perspective. I think the 'supervised' portion of this topic is where I have my hang-ups. I'm sure there are kids who are perfectly responsible and can handle having a firearm in their room and solely under their discretion. They may even be in the majority. I don't know that I think it's a great idea as kids are kids. They tend to be more impulsive, more rash, and have less of a sense of proportion about the ills they perceive. I'm not going to argue that adults can be subject to all of the above, we all know the type. I think little Johny or Susie can own a gun, but I generally think an adult should be in possession of it until it's time to use it. This does open a self-defense argument that I'm not sure I can square this view with.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bella wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

While I'm very into teaching kids to shoot, 10 years old it too young for a kid to have free access to firearms and ammo. While this sounds rather deliberate, too many kids die "playing" with firearms left unsecured by adults.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from steve182 wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

A 10 year old may be mature enough to shoot guns and/or go hunting, but he or she is not mature enough to own or possess guns. No way. They should always be locked and unloaded when not in use. a possible exception is a bb gun, but even those require adult supervision at that age. Very sad story. C'mon people, lock'em up.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from wgiles wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

At that age, no. I was that age 50 years ago. I got my first rifle when I was 12, but I was only allowed to shoot it under my father's supervision. The rest of the time, it was locked up with the rest of the firearms. These days, I would probably not allow free access to firearms until the child was of legal age to own it and had all of the required training and documents. In Illinois, we have to have a Firearms Owner's ID card.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from FirstBubba wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

The first time my kids asked me about guns in general, they were introduced to everything I owned at the time. They were allowed to shoot .22's ad nauseam. They were constantly reminded that firearms kill humans as well as game animals. Their mother assisted in this training and helped reinforce that guns are deadly when handled wrong, but perfectly safe when handled correctly. Both my children ended up in law enforcement. I'm VERY proud of them both.
They have both been handling guns since age 4 or 5. Both have had open access to every arm in the house from that point forward. Some kids can handle the responsibility just fine at age 10, some can't.

Bubba

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from mad_dog9999 wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

Thats what gun cabinets and safes are for. Lock up your guns when not in use. And keep the key out of reach or hidden in a safe spot.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from smallgamehunter25 wrote 1 year 18 weeks ago

I think that as long as theres no ammo in the possesion of the child or some that they can get to they should be able to have guns in their room, because without ammo whats gonna happen? I'm 16 and have my guns on my wall on the gunrack I made in woodworking and I think they make the room look nice, just sayin.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mike Plotner wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

i heard about that the kid had 1 rifle and 3 shotguns. i keep my guns in my room. they are in a locked cabnit except for a .22 single shot wich i use for coon hunting that is in my closet. and my little brother and sister know that me mom and dad are the only ones alowed to handel them unless one of us is around. the ammo is also locked up so thats a plus.when i was ten i had a bb gun and i chould shoot dads .22 but they were in my parents room. i think he should have just had a bb gun at ten unless the guns are kept in a parents room

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I believe the guns should be locked up and secure. A 10-year-old should not have easy access to them. I believe if there a guns in the home, a 10-year-old should have had extensive training in how to use a gun and the results of shooting a gun.

However, that is a family issue, and not something to be determines or set in law by any level of government.

Also, please remember that this is not a gun issue. Any 10-year-old who would be willing to shoot his own (?) mother because of a disagreement over chores would just have easily clubbed her with a baseball-bat or stabbed her with a knife. A gun, I'll admit is more convenient and more lethal, but the problem is the kid, not the guns.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Dcast wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

Guns are not toys. No kid should have access to a gun even if you feel they are mature enough. Maturity has nothing to do with whether or not a child and even teenagers are able to have access to a gun. Kids and teenagers do not have the mentality to have access to guns, they react on emotions and often times don't think of the consequences of their actions until after the fact. With age comes wisdom, rationality, and then responsibility, you need the 1st two before the 3rd requirement to have a gun at your disposal and as far as I'm concerned 18yrs old MINIMUM would be the age requirement for someone to have easy access to a gun, and will be in my house. This was a serious lack of responsibility on the parents part and unfortunately they had to pay the price with the loss of a life. This shows also being an adult doesn't automatically mean you should have access to a gun because these people clearly dropped the ball on wisdom, rationality, and responsibility.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from kansasjeff wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I've often wondered about the appropriate age for a first gun. For me my Grandpa began teaching me to shoot when I was 10 (.22 rifle that he kept locked up in his gun cabinet and I was NOT allowed to touch it unless he or my Grandma were teaching me) also he began teaching me to hunt at the same time. At 12 I was given a BB gun that I could use around the woods near their farm. (Also kept locked in the gun cabinet and I had to ask permission to take it out.) For Christmas when I was 15 I was giving a 20 gauge shotgun to hunt rabbits and birds alongside my grandpa. (Again same rules applied as with the BB gun.)

When I tell some people this they are shocked that I had access to firearms at such a young age. Other people tell me they had their first gun much younger. It’s clear to me that NO parent should let their child have easy and unsupervised access to a gun.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from lamson yankee wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

The young boy did the crime,not the gun.I watched this story on the news last week and obviously there was much more to the story.The bottom line always rests with the parents! This boy has many "self" issues which were not addressed by the family sadly as it is......

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from ricefarm wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I was 12 when I got my first shotgun. Like many of you when I started driving I sometimes had it in my trunk, as did many of my friends. The only case I knew of where a kid shot someone was a boy protecting his mom from a very abusive dad. It simply never would have occured to any of us to shoot someone to settle anything. I don't know if you blame violence on tv, video games or what but it's obvious some of these kids today are exposed to something that gives them a very casual attitude about killing, but don't try to tell me the problem is access to guns.

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from greyhunter wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

Because of the decline of hunters numbers in Pa. The state and many hunter groups are pushing mentored hunting. Some parents evidently feel this means it is now safe to leave a 10 year old complete access to arms and ammunition. They may be able to pull the trigger when a firearm is held for them on game, but they lack maturity and judgement. Would you leave the car keys with them? Too bad the mother didn't act on her fears and remove the damn guns in spite of his protests. Who is in charge, children or parents?

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Wmorris wrote 1 year 19 weeks ago

I was introduced to guns and hunting by my father way before I was even big enough to carry a .22 rifle. He kept his guns secured however. I raised two children and introduced them to weapons and hunting also at a young age. They were really impressed with was my .357 and 9 mm did to a milk carton full of water but they also appreciated what they could do to a human body. I trusted my children by kept my weapons secured. I think it is normal to introduce children to weapons at a young age, but they must be kept secured! A fatal mistake whether by accident or on purpose. We must teach young people responsibility and consequences whether it be with weapons or life in general. Just another reason for the anti's to rant against guns and hunting.

0 Good Comment? | | Report

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