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British Cadets Not Allowed to March with Rifles in Parade for Fear of Glamorizing Weapons

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November 09, 2010

British Cadets Not Allowed to March with Rifles in Parade for Fear of Glamorizing Weapons

By Chad Love

Here's one from the "so dumb we're left speechless" files: British army cadets cannot carry rifles in a Remembrance Day parade because it glamorizes weapons and would upset people.

From this story in the (UK) Daily Mail:
Army cadets have been left ‘bitterly disappointed’ after being banned from carrying rifles on a Remembrance Day parade - amid fears the weapons might 'upset' onlookers. The young cadets have proudly marched with rifles for decades and around 100 had spent months fine-tuning the drill where they would showcase their skills. But the cadets were left 'gutted' just days before the big event when military top brass cut the rifles from the display following complaints from members of the public.

They were warned the rifle display during the march in Plymouth, Devon, could be deemed as 'glamorising' weapons. Cadets were left 'bitterly disappointed' by the late change, which organisers today branded 'political correctness gone mad'. Basil Downing-Waite, chairman of the Federation of Plymouth and District Ex Services Associations, which organised the event, said: 'It's political correctness gone mad. I feel bitterly disappointed because it gives the young people a sense of responsibility. ‘They are delighted to do these displays.' The Remembrance Day march is still due to go ahead, but without rifles. A senior cadet instructor said the children had been left 'very upset' by the ruling.

Police Chief Inspector Brendan Brookshaw said his son Henry and daughter Rosie were 'very disappointed' at the late change. But Devon Cadet Executive Officer Major David Waterworth put an end to the tradition after he ruled that carrying weapons was 'not good for the image' of cadets, who can join between the ages of 12 and 18. He said: 'There is no need for children to appear in public with weapons. It does upset some members of the public. 'There is no need for it. It doesn't reflect our aims and ethos in the Army Cadet Force. We are not soldiers. 'People say it's traditional at Remembrance parades, but there is no need to carry a weapon to remember the dead. 'I stopped it as soon as I heard they were doing it. It's not good for our image to have children carrying weapons in public. 'We are not members of the Armed Forces - we are a youth movement sponsored by the Ministry of Defence.' He added that a ruling against children carrying rifles had been in place for ten years, but had not been enforced until now.

Discuss...

Comments (17)

Top Rated
All Comments
from BigJim wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Where do you think the word "infantry" comes from?

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bella wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Give 'em pikes. Swords too. They'll like that. Pike drill is what the manual of arms is based on anyway and you can call pikes flagpoles if you put a pennant on each one. They won't do it of course, but this is one more reason why one goes to England, see a few castles, drink a few ales and comes home.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Dcast wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

What can one say? This is absolutely hilarious, how would they be glamorizing weapons unless of course they B-dazzled them! I feel sorry for the people who have any mind left that live in England.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Aside from the fact that these are cadets and sponsored under their MoD, I think that the Major may be on to something.

The militarization of youth (some of these are 12 year olds- most of our JROTC programs don't allow the manual of arms to be performed with anything other than a wooden drill rifle without a barrel) is something that we have testified to the UN about. We are trying to eliminate Child Soldiers the world over, and granted that these cadets are not Soldiers, the image that they may portray to their citizens in the UK while under arms is something that many of the brits do not want to see.

I think that the parade can go on, with the cadets marching sharply in step, leaving those who bear arms professionally to do the heavy carrying on that day, as they always have. Allow those who are still children to be children, while remembering sacrifices of those who have provided their opportunity to still be kids.

-5 Good Comment? | | Report
from cmikles1 wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

They look real intimidating. Like the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade without floats.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Is it wrong for young people to train for a future in the military, if that is what they "want to be when they grow up?"

Does training for the military involve weapons?

I would much rather see disciplined, educated young people training with weapons and learning weapons' proper care and usage than for them to join their peers in mindless blood-sport through intense video-gaming.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

wow- a -1 just for saying let children be children without having weapons in a parade.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from FlyBorchetti wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Why is it when I look at this picture I hear the Benny Hill theme song in my head?

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

HeidelbergJaeger:
I have four boys, ages 1 through 6. They are children.

The 12-18 year olds mentioned in the article are young adults who should be, and apparently are, thinking about their future and planning for adulthood.

I agree that "children" should not be playing with guns or "glorifying" violence. This is why we do not have any blood-and-guts video games and will not have any. But the young adults mentioned in the article are another category altogether. They are not children.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Steward.. good that you see it with your viewpoint. I have mine as well. For any of the others who can't handle an opposing viewpoint- I feel for you.

I have been an Army Recruiter, and am currently serving on active duty in Afghanistan. I am not speaking without experience.I have been in uniform since before I was 18. The militarization of those above the age of legal consent is fine and good. However, we are talking about kids in middle school and up to high school.

Do you mean to tell me that at 12-14 years of age that a child is capable of the forethought required to understand the total implications of their actions at any given time? Surely you don't.

Then again, the age has little to do with it. I believe it is about maturity. Are you're saying that the 12 year olds referenced in this story are not children? Really? Because there are many others like you who had the same thought that arming the youth of their nation was acceptable, namely Adolph Hitler. Ever heard of the Hitler Youth?

Let's review your statement: "The 12-18 year olds mentioned in the article are young adults who should be, and apparently are, thinking about their future and planning for adulthood." You mean to tell me that 12 and 13 year olds need to be planning for adulthood? Why aren't they concentrating on developing socially and educationally? Militarizing youth removes them from the social construct and puts them into a homogenous sub-sect of the overall society at large. This robs them of the opportunity to develop with the same frame of reference as their contemporaries that do not go through that same path. Why do you think that there is always such a divide between those who have served and those who have not?

The "cadets" (I originally thought these were service academy cadets-not the likes of school age children who are a member of an auxillary organization) in this article are still children. In every sense of the word. Legally they are kids and when you have 18 year olds being prosecuted for offeses as minors, the courts agree.

Weapons safety begins at home, with you I agree on this. However, for the sake of a parade, if this really got your blood pressure up, considering it isn't even in the US, well then maybe some priorities need to be reassessed.

Apparently, according to those on this board, the world needs more Child Soldiers, as we don't have enough.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

HeidelbergJaeger:
First, Thank you for your service. My path in life has not taken me that direction, but I respect you and all that you do.

Second, let's get the personal things out of the way:

1-This parade in another country does not get my blood pressure up.
2-To state that people on this board support "Child Soldiers" anywhere in the world is inflamatory and a straw man argument that lessens the significance of your previous comments.

I do not have the time to try to refute everything you posted above, nor would it be helpful. But here is a key point: These young people are not being prohibited from from drilling with guns or from being trained in their use; they are simply being denied a decades-old privilege of marching/drilling in this parade while carrying them. Appearances are being altered to soothe the sensibilities of a vocal, overly sensitive minority.

The only other thing I will address right now is the comparison to the Hitler Youth. I understood this to be something similar to America's ROTC program. I believe these to Hitler Youth is a poor comparison. I will fight tooth and nail to prevent such an organization from forming in my country, and would never allow my boys to be part of such an organization. Not because it involved weapons training, but because it centered around indoctrinating those young people with an ethos and policy that was despicable, inhuman, and ungodly.

No hard feelings.

Keep your head down, and come home safely!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Steward, no hard feelings either. I don't have a problem with weapons familiarization at all, i was just saying that I can understand the view point of the parents who complained.

Thanks for the well wishes, enjoy the rut and the rest of deer season.

-2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Clay Cooper wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Shouldn't be surprised, that's why we celebrate Thanksgiving!

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from YooperRyan wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

"The British are coming! The British are coming! Oh, wait, never mind, sorry to wake you ma'am"

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jeff4066 wrote 1 year 25 weeks ago

There are good comments on both sides, and I must admit I have mixed feelings about this.

The cadet duty should be part-time. That means, like JROTC, or even Scouts, they have that time when they are learning those skills, and also their regular life with their friends, too. That means they are not being de-socialized. They are not being brainwashed into a specific belief, like the reference to the Hitler Jugend, which was practically 24 hour a day training.

I don't mind organized training with weapons. As far as teenagers to that young age, I feel there should be limits. Ranges and target shooting, yes. Learning to dismantle, clean and reassemble rifles, yes. That's not evil in nature. It shouldn't run too far off the course of what a father might do with his son.

But the nastier aspects should be totally verboten until that person has reached an age when they can join the military, if they so choose. What I mean by that is no "playing soldier" with training like; fixed bayonets, close combat, urban assault and clearing buildings. That takes the dark side of war too close to home for young ones. And no "area weapons".

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Johns_written_words wrote 1 year 25 weeks ago

How does the Hitler Youth end up being dragged into this?
These are cadets, like our ROTC cadets which is a paramilitary organization. They learn things like discipline, marksmanship, care and opperation of arms, and other martial skills. That makes them neither "child soldiers" or the Hitler Youth.

The concept that bearing arms is somehow intimidating and should be banned from public display is rediculous. Whether these cadets are 12 years old or not should not make one bit of difference. Their parents, neighbors and country should be proud that they are trained or being trained to be disciplined and skilled in the use of arms.

A "child" carrying a rifle in a disciplined and safe manner should not cause people to wet their pants and become terrified.

Paramilitary oraganizations such as Junior ROTC programs are not creating the next generation of Hitler Youth. Instead, they are teaching MARTIAL skills and discipline to young men and women that are interested in military service. Those skills include less controversial subjects such as map reading and land navagation, but also the use of arms.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from dhpierre wrote 1 year 23 weeks ago

HeidelbergJaeger your comparing British Army Cadets to child soldiers and Hilter youth disgusts me. As an USAF vet it hard for me to belive I was it hearing from a Military member. You should know better. You have every right to object the JROTC and Army Cadets drilling with rifles(but for the life of me I'll never understand why). Cadet progams don't rob our youth of anything. It teaches them responsibility, disipline, teamwork, and leadership. All things you should be encouraging in our youth especially as Military member. So next time think long and hard before you compare them to NAZIS!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report

Post a Comment

from Dcast wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

What can one say? This is absolutely hilarious, how would they be glamorizing weapons unless of course they B-dazzled them! I feel sorry for the people who have any mind left that live in England.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jeff4066 wrote 1 year 25 weeks ago

There are good comments on both sides, and I must admit I have mixed feelings about this.

The cadet duty should be part-time. That means, like JROTC, or even Scouts, they have that time when they are learning those skills, and also their regular life with their friends, too. That means they are not being de-socialized. They are not being brainwashed into a specific belief, like the reference to the Hitler Jugend, which was practically 24 hour a day training.

I don't mind organized training with weapons. As far as teenagers to that young age, I feel there should be limits. Ranges and target shooting, yes. Learning to dismantle, clean and reassemble rifles, yes. That's not evil in nature. It shouldn't run too far off the course of what a father might do with his son.

But the nastier aspects should be totally verboten until that person has reached an age when they can join the military, if they so choose. What I mean by that is no "playing soldier" with training like; fixed bayonets, close combat, urban assault and clearing buildings. That takes the dark side of war too close to home for young ones. And no "area weapons".

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Is it wrong for young people to train for a future in the military, if that is what they "want to be when they grow up?"

Does training for the military involve weapons?

I would much rather see disciplined, educated young people training with weapons and learning weapons' proper care and usage than for them to join their peers in mindless blood-sport through intense video-gaming.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from cmikles1 wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

They look real intimidating. Like the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade without floats.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

HeidelbergJaeger:
I have four boys, ages 1 through 6. They are children.

The 12-18 year olds mentioned in the article are young adults who should be, and apparently are, thinking about their future and planning for adulthood.

I agree that "children" should not be playing with guns or "glorifying" violence. This is why we do not have any blood-and-guts video games and will not have any. But the young adults mentioned in the article are another category altogether. They are not children.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Steward wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

HeidelbergJaeger:
First, Thank you for your service. My path in life has not taken me that direction, but I respect you and all that you do.

Second, let's get the personal things out of the way:

1-This parade in another country does not get my blood pressure up.
2-To state that people on this board support "Child Soldiers" anywhere in the world is inflamatory and a straw man argument that lessens the significance of your previous comments.

I do not have the time to try to refute everything you posted above, nor would it be helpful. But here is a key point: These young people are not being prohibited from from drilling with guns or from being trained in their use; they are simply being denied a decades-old privilege of marching/drilling in this parade while carrying them. Appearances are being altered to soothe the sensibilities of a vocal, overly sensitive minority.

The only other thing I will address right now is the comparison to the Hitler Youth. I understood this to be something similar to America's ROTC program. I believe these to Hitler Youth is a poor comparison. I will fight tooth and nail to prevent such an organization from forming in my country, and would never allow my boys to be part of such an organization. Not because it involved weapons training, but because it centered around indoctrinating those young people with an ethos and policy that was despicable, inhuman, and ungodly.

No hard feelings.

Keep your head down, and come home safely!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from YooperRyan wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

"The British are coming! The British are coming! Oh, wait, never mind, sorry to wake you ma'am"

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Johns_written_words wrote 1 year 25 weeks ago

How does the Hitler Youth end up being dragged into this?
These are cadets, like our ROTC cadets which is a paramilitary organization. They learn things like discipline, marksmanship, care and opperation of arms, and other martial skills. That makes them neither "child soldiers" or the Hitler Youth.

The concept that bearing arms is somehow intimidating and should be banned from public display is rediculous. Whether these cadets are 12 years old or not should not make one bit of difference. Their parents, neighbors and country should be proud that they are trained or being trained to be disciplined and skilled in the use of arms.

A "child" carrying a rifle in a disciplined and safe manner should not cause people to wet their pants and become terrified.

Paramilitary oraganizations such as Junior ROTC programs are not creating the next generation of Hitler Youth. Instead, they are teaching MARTIAL skills and discipline to young men and women that are interested in military service. Those skills include less controversial subjects such as map reading and land navagation, but also the use of arms.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from dhpierre wrote 1 year 23 weeks ago

HeidelbergJaeger your comparing British Army Cadets to child soldiers and Hilter youth disgusts me. As an USAF vet it hard for me to belive I was it hearing from a Military member. You should know better. You have every right to object the JROTC and Army Cadets drilling with rifles(but for the life of me I'll never understand why). Cadet progams don't rob our youth of anything. It teaches them responsibility, disipline, teamwork, and leadership. All things you should be encouraging in our youth especially as Military member. So next time think long and hard before you compare them to NAZIS!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from BigJim wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Where do you think the word "infantry" comes from?

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from FlyBorchetti wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Why is it when I look at this picture I hear the Benny Hill theme song in my head?

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bella wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Give 'em pikes. Swords too. They'll like that. Pike drill is what the manual of arms is based on anyway and you can call pikes flagpoles if you put a pennant on each one. They won't do it of course, but this is one more reason why one goes to England, see a few castles, drink a few ales and comes home.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

wow- a -1 just for saying let children be children without having weapons in a parade.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Steward.. good that you see it with your viewpoint. I have mine as well. For any of the others who can't handle an opposing viewpoint- I feel for you.

I have been an Army Recruiter, and am currently serving on active duty in Afghanistan. I am not speaking without experience.I have been in uniform since before I was 18. The militarization of those above the age of legal consent is fine and good. However, we are talking about kids in middle school and up to high school.

Do you mean to tell me that at 12-14 years of age that a child is capable of the forethought required to understand the total implications of their actions at any given time? Surely you don't.

Then again, the age has little to do with it. I believe it is about maturity. Are you're saying that the 12 year olds referenced in this story are not children? Really? Because there are many others like you who had the same thought that arming the youth of their nation was acceptable, namely Adolph Hitler. Ever heard of the Hitler Youth?

Let's review your statement: "The 12-18 year olds mentioned in the article are young adults who should be, and apparently are, thinking about their future and planning for adulthood." You mean to tell me that 12 and 13 year olds need to be planning for adulthood? Why aren't they concentrating on developing socially and educationally? Militarizing youth removes them from the social construct and puts them into a homogenous sub-sect of the overall society at large. This robs them of the opportunity to develop with the same frame of reference as their contemporaries that do not go through that same path. Why do you think that there is always such a divide between those who have served and those who have not?

The "cadets" (I originally thought these were service academy cadets-not the likes of school age children who are a member of an auxillary organization) in this article are still children. In every sense of the word. Legally they are kids and when you have 18 year olds being prosecuted for offeses as minors, the courts agree.

Weapons safety begins at home, with you I agree on this. However, for the sake of a parade, if this really got your blood pressure up, considering it isn't even in the US, well then maybe some priorities need to be reassessed.

Apparently, according to those on this board, the world needs more Child Soldiers, as we don't have enough.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Clay Cooper wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Shouldn't be surprised, that's why we celebrate Thanksgiving!

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Steward, no hard feelings either. I don't have a problem with weapons familiarization at all, i was just saying that I can understand the view point of the parents who complained.

Thanks for the well wishes, enjoy the rut and the rest of deer season.

-2 Good Comment? | | Report
from HeidelbergJaeger wrote 1 year 28 weeks ago

Aside from the fact that these are cadets and sponsored under their MoD, I think that the Major may be on to something.

The militarization of youth (some of these are 12 year olds- most of our JROTC programs don't allow the manual of arms to be performed with anything other than a wooden drill rifle without a barrel) is something that we have testified to the UN about. We are trying to eliminate Child Soldiers the world over, and granted that these cadets are not Soldiers, the image that they may portray to their citizens in the UK while under arms is something that many of the brits do not want to see.

I think that the parade can go on, with the cadets marching sharply in step, leaving those who bear arms professionally to do the heavy carrying on that day, as they always have. Allow those who are still children to be children, while remembering sacrifices of those who have provided their opportunity to still be kids.

-5 Good Comment? | | Report

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