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Question by ws4964fx. Uploaded on June 02, 2009
I would choose a good bolt gun like my Kimber Mdl 8400 classic in 25-06. for both. The ultimate long range gun for 'lopes & goats would likely be a 257 Weatherby in a long barreled bolt action.
257 Weatherby cost to damn much for ammo, go with the 25-06 you will not know the difference of the 100 to 150 fps half the velocity of my bow!
Dont overlook the .264 Win Mag. The 25/06 would be an awesome choice though.
I've had great luck with my 7mm Mag, it shoot straight and performs well in high winds which is pretty frequent when shooting prong horns. I bought a savage and i think it was under $400 new. Good Luck
Goats/lopes' neither are "hard" to kill. Del is right though I'd use a bolt gun. I'd start in the .250 Savage range for the lopes'(shot mine with a .300 Win. Mag)/(New rifle, and wanted to give it a work out. Yes I know it was a little more than needed).
Never shot a goat though.
Mr. O' Conner(Jack) would say .270 is all you'll need for both.
ole reliable 30-06,150-180gr
The .240 weatherby would also foot the bill too.
I'll take the 25/06 with a good bullet on both. In a good bolt gun it turn out exceptional accuracy and in a rig with a 24 inch barrel it will only be about 100 fps or so behind the .257 Weatherby. My favorite load for the 25/06 is the 110 grain Nosler Accubond on top of 59.0 grains of Retumbo in a Winchester Case and Winchester large rifle primer.
for antelope i would say hands down the 25-06, and for mountain goat i would like a 300 win mag, or a 30-06
It's not so much the gun but the person behind it. Knowing where the bullet will hit at specific ranges is more important than the caliber.
I shot a Mouflon sheep in Spain last April using a Savage 100 bolt action.308 cal at 375 yards, using Winchester sp2 loads. The nine year old full curl ram fell to his knees without taking another step.
The gun cost me $300 new and the Nikon scope cost me $325 new. So this inexpensive combo can go on any safari or in the back yard. It was the talk of the camp. I was out shooting all the guys that spend thousands. HA! in your face bank account!
6.5 Grendel would be my 1st choice. 6.8 Rem SPC would be my 2nd, 270 Win would be my 3rd. Accuracy, light recoil, and reasonable wind drift would be my qualifiers.
Though not widely chambered, the .260rem would be a peach for antelopes and goats. any of the .25 or .26s would do well.
When we first moved to Wyoming from S Texas in 1989;
My son took Hunter Safety course Here & hunted Pronghorn ; Elk ; & Muley deer with my custom 3006 '03 Springfield . ( The rifle with Leupold Scope & long bbl weighs about 8.75 lb)_ too heavy for me now. HE had success almost each autumn shooting Hornady Light Mag 150 gr on Muley & Pronghorn.
He took elk 3 seasons with same rifle & Hornady Light Mag 180 gr.
Now we will use a New Weatherby Vanguard 270 composite stock.
The wind lots of the time here is like being on plains of western Kansas where I grew up.
25-06; 6.5_06 mm Ackley ; 270 win 280 Rem Ackley;
30/06 are all good choices in the hands of a conservative hunter familiar WITH HIS RIFLE.
I am not an antelope or goat hunter...would like to give it a try sometime, but my experience is with whitetail. I am curious why nobody has mentioned the 270WSM. I guess it may be a little too much horsepower than is really needed but it is very flat shooting.
Don't forget the .243 I think it could definitely be one of the best antelope rifles hands down. For the goats - I'd go with the 7mm Rem. Mag. I killed an elk at 742 yards with my 7mm this last fall (1-shot with a witness...in case anyone was wondering!) and they will shoot as far and straight as you can as a shooter.
Another thing to keep in mind is ammunition availability. You can almost guarantee there to be .243 Win and 7mm Rem Mag ammo nearly everywhere. I've had trouble finding even 25/06 ammo at some places. If you are going out of the country to hunt goats, you better take ammo in two separate bags, and have a stockpile in the event one or the other is lost...
I've got to go with a .270 win or .270 WSM. Many good choices including .280 rem., .308 and 7mm rem. Mag.
Actually the .270 WSM would be a great combo round for these animals.
I was going to say that a regular old .270 would serve you well on both these hunts.
Your pronghorn gun can be a little weighty and long barreled for steady shots and full performance, as pronghorn country isn't all that rough and is somewhat flat. I'm thinking a Weatherby. Anything .25 caliber would be great. .243 works, and bigger never hurts.
Your mountain goat gun should be very light and compact, but still have some power, big billies can go to around 300 pounds. They live on some crazy stuff and it's hard to get close. I've seen a few up in places where I would never go without full-on climbing gear. They're insane. They get killed by falls more than anything else. I'm thinking Remington Mountain LSS in .270 fits the bill.
Ultimate sheep gun - Nosler Custom 48 .270 WSM. Very light, extremely accurate, very durable and weatherproof. Very expensive, but it is more than enough gun to take everything the sheep and the mountain can throw at it.
300 Win Mag. 180 grain Barns Tripple shock. Flat enough, big enough for a Griz if needed. End of Story.
I don't compromise my hunting rifle just because there is a tiny chance of grizzly problems. For mountain goats, if you're serious, you'll be above the grizzlies. They don't just run around attacking people. It's rare, and it almost always is provoked. Not all of this type of hunting is done in grizzly country, and prongorn hunting rarely is. There are sheep in places other than the rockies.
If you are serious about grizzlies, you don't take a .300. You have a .338 minimum. So I guess all hunting within 100 miles of grizzlies requires you carry a .338?
If you want to haul around a .338 on near vertical slopes at 10,000-16,000', have fun.
Also, with such thin wimpy animals as pronghorns, sheep, and goats (mountain goats are actually pretty tough, but thin sided), you don't want a tough penetrating bullet like a TSX. You want something that will expand fairly quickly and mash the vitals good instead of one that will zip right through. You don't want to have to track or shoot twice in that kind of terrain/situation. You want a bangflop.
For the Lopes, my choice is my Rem 700 custom shop 25-o6 shooting Winchester Ballastic tip ll7 gr bullets.For the Sheep/Goats my 700 custom shop 30-06 gets the nod with l80 gr Rem Scirocco's'. I think the 25-06 would be ok on either, but with the winds and distance for sheep/goats I feel a tad more horsepower is necessary, as you want to drop that animal in it's tracts and not tumble down the mtn and break the head-gear. Shoot-um-straight and often. PS: the winds in WY never stop
I wouldn't give it a second thought using a 25-06 with 117 grain Hornady soft point boat tale!
I love toting my Browning 338 Win Mag at 10,000 to 16,000 feet and so did my hunting buddies!
I have hunted antelope in Wyoming for 35 years. I usually take a buck and a doe every year. For the first 25 years I used a .270 with a 130-150 gr. bullet. When members of our hunting party couldn't bring their guns on planes immediately after 9-11, I loaned out the .270 and hunted with my 30-06. I have hunted with the 30-06 and 150 gr Silvertips bullets ever since. The reason for the change is more killing power. The wind in Wyoming howls. You might get one or two days during a week of hunting without strong wind. The strong gusts make it very hard to get a steady shot at a distance. Antelope aren't that big and it is easy for a heart/lung shot in the gusty wind to hit bone in the shoulder. I have had 3 antelope over the years that were hit with the .270, knocked to the ground for several minutes, get up and run for miles on 3 legs. Two of the wounded antelope ran to private land and were never retrieved. The shots that I have hit shoulder with the 30-06 have all resulted in kills. The .270 has the power to make a kill if you hit a shoulder, but the one antelope out of 10 it doesn't kill will be your trophy buck.
KCurfman you are right about the wind in Wyoming. I have had one failure to stop with a .270/130 and another with a .30-'06/165 on deer. Fortunately all my Wyoming pronghorns have been taken on public land but I would not enjoy loosing one that made it to private property which prevented me from recovering it. By the same token you don't want a mountain goat to take one of those jumps they sometimes do when shot as often it is over the side of the mountain making recovery difficult in a different way. As I have said before I have an old .243 which has killed over 40 deer and antelope over the years. I think the ability for many shooters to put that little 6 mm 100 gr boattailed pill where it needs to be is the reason plus all shots were taken at reasonable ranges.
My first choice for antelope this year is area 82, 62 for elk, and 165 for deer. Did you happen to apply for any of those?
Shane I can assure you if you hunt in the mountains around northwest Wyoming you will encounter a grizzly, the odds are tiny that you will not. By the same token I am not aware of any of dozens of attacks that were provoked unless you consider it to be the case when a sportsman or sportswoman accidently walks between a sow and cubs. The dead and wounded who were in their sleeping bags at the time of the attack certainly did not consider themselves to be provoking the bears. I suppose just their presence was adequate.
My old custom .338 has been hauled for miles at 5000 to 10000 feet for almost thirty years, I can't speak for the other 6000 vertical feet although I probably made it up to 11 grand one afternoon.
Buy one good rifle.
Shoot it often enough to become accurate in variable conditions.
Learn where to hit your game to kill it.
Choose loads carefully.
O'Connor said .270.
Which is about the same as 30-06, though flatter-shooting.
Spend more time on the range than at the gunshop.
You have seen zillions of Grizzlies, Ish, but has one ever attacked you? Probably not. I have seen quite a few, and quite a few have seen me, and none of them acted aggressively. Same with browns. I'm going to take the rifle I want for the game I'm after, and not worry about a very unlikely bear attack. Just be smart and you won't get eaten.
If you want to carry your .338 here -
-or in Tajikistan go for it. It's overkill. Why carry an 9 pound .338 when you can have a 6.5 pound .270? For you western guys that think your elk hunts are steep and nasty, I have one word for you. Tajikistan.
Unfortunately I work in the hospital where we try to fix the poor souls who think along your lines when venturing into our vertical grizzly country. Every man will stand up to a bear in his living room on flat ground but when you are on a mountain side smelling old grizz's breath its a whole different deal. I have never been attacked thank the Lord, that and being very cautious. I know several people who have been assaulted and many more who have crapped their pants during a bluff charge. I'll stick with my heavy old .338 you pack whatever peashooter you can manage.
OK great but I'm not talking about elk. I'm talking about little skinny sheep and goats on near vertical rock faces at higher altitudes than the American Rockies even peak out at. You don't need a .338 for them by any means, and a .338 tends to get heavy in very thin air on near vertical slopes. I know y'all think elk hunting at 10,000 feet on a kinda steep mountain is intense, and a .338 doesn't feel very heavy there, but on bare, near vertical rocks at 16k' is a whole 'nother ballgame.
Now, if I was talking about elk hunting in the Rockies at lower altitudes in the not so steep, not so bare rock stuff, y'all would be right. A .338 is perfect for elk and just enough for a bear attack. But I'm not.
Ask the guys that have done a lot of sheep hunting. They don't take .338s much, whether there are bears or not.
I still stick to my stance on taking the right rifle for your hunt. It's foolish and paranoid to take a gun not as suited to the hunt because you are worried about bears. Name someone that was hunting for something else and got mauled by a bear. If you really are worried about bears, don't take a .338. A .338 is great if you are in a regular bear hunting situation, but a .338 isn't much of a stopper when you have an angry bear bearing down. If you want to take a bear protection gun on your something else hunt, take something serious like .375 and up. Hunt sheep with a .416. Make sense?
I had to make that choice over 40 years ago and I chose the 25-06 even before they were a commercial cartrige. I've never regretted it and I have NEVER shot alongside someone that gave me an urge to buy their rifle but I have had a lot of offers for mine. This includes the .257 Weatherby. With my 90 grain antelope loads, I get at least 500 fps extra speed over a 150g 30-06 bullet and that is noticable in lead. I have a little problem with wind, but who doesn't. The wind DOES blow out on the prairie. Two years ago, I missed my first shot on a 600 yard antelope with gusting 40-50 mph wind from 9:00. That wasn't because a .30 caliber bullet would have bucked the wind better, it was because I mis-calculated the wind speed. I didn't even take the second shot because I considered it would be unsportsmanlike once I saw exactly what the wind drift was. My cousins who have probably shot more antelope than anyone around are now both hunting them with 22/250s in their old age. They like the speed and just don't shoot at anything over 500 yards. I can shoot my 75g bullets at about 3850 fps but I don't use them on antelope because of the extensive meat damage. I have plinked a few with a .223 and they work fine... you will see that anything between the .223 and the .25 will work. I really don't like the idea of bullets bigger than a .25 bouncing around the prairie... there are cows, buffalo, and ranchers out there and a .30 caliber bullet goes a LONG way after the first bounce. I strongly prefer the little highly frangible bullets for antelope on the prairie. As far as mountain goats, the prime difference is that you usually have to walk down in a canyon to retrieve them and you should can use a 100 grain or 117 grain bullet because they don't run 70 mph.
I swear by my Savage .270. I have taken 10 antelope with that gun. My buddy's autoloader jammed so I told him to put it away and use mine. Another fun gun for speed goats is my Marlin Model 336 3030. I shot the first one last year at 80 yards with a Williams Peep sight and that animal dropped in its tracks. I plan on taking both from here on out. The lever action for 100 yard shots and the .270 for anything over and there are a lot of long shots in Wyoming
I've shot many a deer and goat (what antelope are most often called in SD) with my 30-06 150 gr. over the years. As a kid I shot my share with an ironsighted 30-30. I agree with idahoeditor, know your gun's capabilities, practice a lot, and shoot with enough bullet to knock your game down. I love hunting on the prairie for the spot and stalk aspect. The fun is getting with-in 100 yards for a standing shot. I'd suggest anyone who is trying to shoot their goats, or elk, at over 300 yards is more concerned with being Annie Oakley than a good hunter. Get a little dust on your boots and knees and elbows.
Wind is a huge problem here in my home state of Wyoming. A 257 Roberts is plenty for mountain goats, prairie goats,sheep,and mule deer. 120 grain bullet. Never lost an animal in 40 years. Never shot an animal more than once. Its the right blend of speed and weight. It is the definition of "a one hit wonder". Longest shot was 425 yards at a goat laying down. At the report he stood up and walked about 15 paces and collapsed. Get your trigger worked over by a gun smith. It does not matter what medium bore you shoot. It all comes down to the trigger pull. Smooth and crisp.
Ruger Nº1 .300 RUM - Level I for Antelope and Level II for mountain hunting
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