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Deeter: Help Me Catch That Scum-Sucking Pig! (And win a fly rod).

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October 22, 2009

Deeter: Help Me Catch That Scum-Sucking Pig! (And win a fly rod).

By Kirk Deeter

I'm not the world's greatest angler, by any stretch... but I'm not used to failure.

In this case, we had the camera rolling (for Cermele's new Hook Shots episode, check it out) as a giant rainbow was sipping bugs off the surface in a part of the Colorado River where I reliably catch fish.  I figured that was a done deal.  I was prepared to hook that fish, turn and mug for the camera, and say something smug like, "and THAT'S why I only do one show a day, babe, I won't do two..."

But, alas... I got schooled.  Skunked.  Whiffed.  For the entire Field & Stream nation to see...

Being a man willing to admit that I am still mired in the learning curve (who isn't?), I'm now asking for advice. What would you have done differently?

This fish is following a semi-systematic pattern... chowing down... but there's a thick layer of scum in the target zone. I'd make an almost-perfect cast, and the dry fly would get gobbled up by a bubble of goo (hint: I don't think I had the wrong pattern on)...

If I ripped the fly away and recast... the fish disappeared for 10 minutes. (Oh... we spent a good 30 minutes on this single fish, mixing flies, angles, and approaches). I'm not asking what I did wrong... apparently I did everything wrong. I'm asking what would be the right way to hook and land this fish. Watch the video... think hard.

For the person who gives me the best well-reasoned advice that I believe might actually have worked in this situation... I'll give you a 9-foot 5-weight, Temple Fork Outfitters, Lefty Kreh Professional Series rod. Think carefully... I'll admit I already have theories as to how I might win a rematch with this trout... to the extent you reaffirm them or convince me otherwise, you might just win. How's that for "virtual" fly fishing?

Deeter

Comments (28)

Top Rated
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from Kucher wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I'm not 100% sure, obviously you can never be. But I'm thinking perhaps if you'd trim your hackle a bit to have the fly sit a little lower in the water/ scum bubble might make it more visible while in the feeding lane.

Kucher

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from buckhunter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

That's a tough fish to catch. It appears to be randomly swimming in the back water taking mayflys on and just below the surface. It's so close to the surface he only sees things directly in from of him. Ummm. This sort of random activity requires a soft pin point cast close to the fish but as you state, your line ripping off the water puts the fish down. The stream appears small also making things more difficult.

I have two set ups that might work. Go with a 12-15ft leader tippet combo. The wind does not appear to be blowing hard so you should have an opportunity to still make a pin point cast. The longer leader should help with not putting the fish down on your backcast. Don't be afraid to go with two drys and a dropper. The more flys the better chance you have with being directly in front of the fish. Tie your dropper on with florocarbon so it may work its way below the scum. You should now have above and below the scum covered. Mono floats higher. Rather than putting the fish down 10 mins hold off on your backcast until the fish has swam away then cast again. The longer leader will reduce the disturbance taking your fly line off the water. The fish appears to be cruising pretty good. Limit your cast for when the fish is in the right position. The way I see it you only have so many good cast at a fish.

Use fly floatant on your tippet about 6 inches above your dries. This will help keep the dries up.

+5 Good Comment? | | Report
from WVOtter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Perhaps a wet fly of the same pattern you're using. If you don't ad fly sinkant, it should only sink a few inches, staying in his sight and where it looks like he's roving. This will eliminate collecting skum on the fly. Additionally, as the fly sinks, it will take the tipet with it, decreasing the chance of your tipet bulldozing or coralling the skum and any artificial float patterns/speeds associated with it, which maybe turning the fish off. Finally, he may feel a little stronger sense of urgency to strike at a fly sinking and flowing past him than one on the top he can really examine and be picky about.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from buckhunter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Option II.

Use a Tenkara Rod. The soft presentation will not spook the fish. The ease of casting in tight spots will make you more accurate. With a majority of the line off the water you won't spook the fish "ripping line off the water" on your backcast.

I would use the same set up as above except go with the braided leader for the Tenkara. It acts as your fly line only it is much softer.

By the way, I'm not getting paid to pitch these rods. I just love them. Come on over to the darkside.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Riceman wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

You should have bonked 'em with a big articulated streamer Deeter. Done deal. Next...

Riceman

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from ejunk wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

It looks like, from the video, that you're on the same side of the river as the fish. I assume you're downstream, but it's hard to tell. What I can see is that little ripples are coming in from the left towards the area where the fish was. I think, if possible, would have tried to get in the river (downstream of the fish) and cast into the ripples (which look relatively foam free) and let the fly/flies bob into the zone. I'd also try to slowly pull the flies out of the zone to recast (when it was time) by retrieving line rather than picking up, but you were probably doing that already.

hard to see! take home opinion: it really looks from the video like the bank wasn't the best place to be.

yrs-
Evan!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from JOHN ANDERSON wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Theres an article in an old F\S.that possibly explaines your situation."Sometimes its just better not to know WHY".Tomarrow is another day.This fish perhaps had a certian hunger for a certian something in the scum line.No offense to you but thats why its called fishing,not catching.Youll catch this fish.Good luck.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from jvento wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Size up to an 18 non-parachute pattern and keep the emerger on. Cast and play the waiting game. Let him find your fly instead of presenting it in front of him

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from MLH wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Bubbles, so taking at least some flies off the surface. Looks to also be making quick movements under the water. So emerger is likely if there is a hatch. What mayflies hatch in still water up there? But what does the trout actually key in on in all that surface scum? Perhaps the shuck sticking down through the surface film. Maybe an emerger with flashy shuck fished still will get its attention.

Perhaps it is keying on rising emergers, sometimes taking them at the surface. Might try an emerger (I'd use a bead head to get through the scum) tossed over some floating debris and slowly pulled or high sticked to the surface.

This looks a lot like fishing in pond scum. Getting the fly out in front of a roaming fish and creating a very slight twitch can get its attention ... or spook it.

If the fish is making wide loops, when the opportunity presents itself, can quietly wade out and create an opening in the scum along its path. Might also try a bit too much liquid floatant, which might push scum away from the fly.

That's all I have, though that trout looks like easy bird food. Do you have eagles in Colorado?

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Sportsman Matt wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Are you planning on releasing the fish aftrer it's caught? If so then I would try to match the hatch and get a bunch of crud on the leader that would make it disappear in the foam.

If you were planning on keeping it, a .22LR makes a small hole and you would just have to get the net downstream from him.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from senglund wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I'd throw something bigger his way so it sticks out a bit.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from cTXn wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Maybe the fish was just camera shy... Try it without the camera on him. If that doesn't work, we're only going to know what you tell us, if you get my drift.

That pun was an accident.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Alex Pernice th... wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Longer leader... As Buckhunter said, I assume the wind was causing a hard slap on the water, and the fly had a lot of drag. Take a longer leader (10-12 feet) and add a 3 foot tippet (Hope you can cast well.) less drag on the fly because of the long tippet piling up on the water.

AP

(Deeter, you surprised me that you couldn't get that fish, but alas, even the best don't catch all the fish there would be none left.)

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from tourneyking734 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I think that your best bet would probably be using a lightly weighted (with lead wire not split shot) nymph version of that fly. keep your rod lower to the water than usual since the wind is a big factor. Try to fish the fly right beneath the surface or in the film, not on top of the surface scum. I've had similar situations on creeks fishing for brook trout and this worked well. Or you could just skip the small flies altogether and tie on a streamer with a moderate sinking tip. cast it in front of the trout and strip it back with quick jerks and pauses. One of those should work very well on any trout, no matter what the size or species.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from grouse hunter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I have had this same problem with the fish not even giving the fly a look. I stumbled on to the solution. I had had put on a size 6 foam hopper in desperation. I worked the fish for 30 minutes. I had made a bad cast and the hopper was dragged accross the foam pool, when my line was caught by the current. The Cuttroat I had been trying to catch hit it on that cast. So I found another fish like that downsteam in the foam pool and tried the same thing with the same result. So now when everything else has failed I cast a hopper as close to the bank and don't mend the line and let the hopper get dragged in front of the fish. The Trout hit it aggessively, more like a bass. I have even started to use small mouse pattern and got the same results.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from baconboy206 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

since all that backwash is carrying all kinds of trout goodys in it matching the hatch wont help, your fly will just blend in, especially with the poor visibility created by the scum. The answer would be to use something that stands out from the scum and the other insects, say a size 8 or 10 humpy in red??

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from fflutterffly wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

if their sippin' off the top I would have put on an emerger with a small dropper of the same type.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from steve182 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

A big ol' nightcrawler?! just kidding

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Big O wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Wrong ? - You told GOD and us your plan and we ALL laughed ! (sorry to easy).
I think sometimes you have to "buck to hatch" and go with a larger "terrestial" to "get their attention".
You should have tried a "hopper". Better luck next time.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Red wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Not sure about all the conditions or exact bugs coming off, but if your fishing the scum pockets of the Colorado, tie on a spinner pattern of the bug you "think" he's eating, add a long dropper with a smaller spinner pattern and sink it! If he's crusing around in the scum, he might just be after the spent mayflies collecting in the pocket.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from elkslayer wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Put on a larger fly in the same pattern and get rid of the dropper.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from fisherman14 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

In this situation I would put on a hevier fly so that it will be able to sink under the scum. Then it may be more visble for the fish and you would have, possibly, caught it. Also, as elkslayer said, I'd lose the dropper, too.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from muskiemaster wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

fifteen foot fly rod and just drop it on top of him. no I'm just kidding I don't know what you could've done, maybe if I had a 9-foot 5-weight, Temple Fork Outfitters fly rod I could go catch him for you, sometimes luck just isn't on your side.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from silvrtung wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

use somethin a little longer, heavier, and more colerful so u can catch its attention its just eatin somrthin that it sees movin when the waters like that.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from aragonnapoles wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Why to try just the floaters? as Buckhunter says just under surface one kind of fly never used... the phantom
something in lates 60's...
Never mind I'm sleepping.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Nympho wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I can't dissagree with the longer, finer tippet theories, but I don't know what he's using and will assume he's tried that. I would tie a spinner pattern on as a second fly, rub it in some muck so it will sink a bit. Spinners are a go to for me in back eddy foam.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from coho310 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

plan A- Use a medium-sized bass bug or a small wooly bugger. If that fails, lose the floatant and dangle it in his face, the drowned perachute adams (small) usually gets 'em.

plan B- Spinning gear.
{try a small spinner that you can run near the surface}

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Christian Emter wrote 2 years 14 weeks ago

Try a Dave's grasshopper. It is a cure for non biting trout every time. I have caught alot of rainbows. just by changing to a grasshopper. Another thing to do is to try to catch him on a Panther Martin Spinner. That again is the magic cure for non biting trout.

0 Good Comment? | | Report

Post a Comment

from buckhunter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

That's a tough fish to catch. It appears to be randomly swimming in the back water taking mayflys on and just below the surface. It's so close to the surface he only sees things directly in from of him. Ummm. This sort of random activity requires a soft pin point cast close to the fish but as you state, your line ripping off the water puts the fish down. The stream appears small also making things more difficult.

I have two set ups that might work. Go with a 12-15ft leader tippet combo. The wind does not appear to be blowing hard so you should have an opportunity to still make a pin point cast. The longer leader should help with not putting the fish down on your backcast. Don't be afraid to go with two drys and a dropper. The more flys the better chance you have with being directly in front of the fish. Tie your dropper on with florocarbon so it may work its way below the scum. You should now have above and below the scum covered. Mono floats higher. Rather than putting the fish down 10 mins hold off on your backcast until the fish has swam away then cast again. The longer leader will reduce the disturbance taking your fly line off the water. The fish appears to be cruising pretty good. Limit your cast for when the fish is in the right position. The way I see it you only have so many good cast at a fish.

Use fly floatant on your tippet about 6 inches above your dries. This will help keep the dries up.

+5 Good Comment? | | Report
from buckhunter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Option II.

Use a Tenkara Rod. The soft presentation will not spook the fish. The ease of casting in tight spots will make you more accurate. With a majority of the line off the water you won't spook the fish "ripping line off the water" on your backcast.

I would use the same set up as above except go with the braided leader for the Tenkara. It acts as your fly line only it is much softer.

By the way, I'm not getting paid to pitch these rods. I just love them. Come on over to the darkside.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from JOHN ANDERSON wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Theres an article in an old F\S.that possibly explaines your situation."Sometimes its just better not to know WHY".Tomarrow is another day.This fish perhaps had a certian hunger for a certian something in the scum line.No offense to you but thats why its called fishing,not catching.Youll catch this fish.Good luck.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from MLH wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Bubbles, so taking at least some flies off the surface. Looks to also be making quick movements under the water. So emerger is likely if there is a hatch. What mayflies hatch in still water up there? But what does the trout actually key in on in all that surface scum? Perhaps the shuck sticking down through the surface film. Maybe an emerger with flashy shuck fished still will get its attention.

Perhaps it is keying on rising emergers, sometimes taking them at the surface. Might try an emerger (I'd use a bead head to get through the scum) tossed over some floating debris and slowly pulled or high sticked to the surface.

This looks a lot like fishing in pond scum. Getting the fly out in front of a roaming fish and creating a very slight twitch can get its attention ... or spook it.

If the fish is making wide loops, when the opportunity presents itself, can quietly wade out and create an opening in the scum along its path. Might also try a bit too much liquid floatant, which might push scum away from the fly.

That's all I have, though that trout looks like easy bird food. Do you have eagles in Colorado?

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Sportsman Matt wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Are you planning on releasing the fish aftrer it's caught? If so then I would try to match the hatch and get a bunch of crud on the leader that would make it disappear in the foam.

If you were planning on keeping it, a .22LR makes a small hole and you would just have to get the net downstream from him.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Alex Pernice th... wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Longer leader... As Buckhunter said, I assume the wind was causing a hard slap on the water, and the fly had a lot of drag. Take a longer leader (10-12 feet) and add a 3 foot tippet (Hope you can cast well.) less drag on the fly because of the long tippet piling up on the water.

AP

(Deeter, you surprised me that you couldn't get that fish, but alas, even the best don't catch all the fish there would be none left.)

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from baconboy206 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

since all that backwash is carrying all kinds of trout goodys in it matching the hatch wont help, your fly will just blend in, especially with the poor visibility created by the scum. The answer would be to use something that stands out from the scum and the other insects, say a size 8 or 10 humpy in red??

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from fflutterffly wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

if their sippin' off the top I would have put on an emerger with a small dropper of the same type.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Kucher wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I'm not 100% sure, obviously you can never be. But I'm thinking perhaps if you'd trim your hackle a bit to have the fly sit a little lower in the water/ scum bubble might make it more visible while in the feeding lane.

Kucher

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from WVOtter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Perhaps a wet fly of the same pattern you're using. If you don't ad fly sinkant, it should only sink a few inches, staying in his sight and where it looks like he's roving. This will eliminate collecting skum on the fly. Additionally, as the fly sinks, it will take the tipet with it, decreasing the chance of your tipet bulldozing or coralling the skum and any artificial float patterns/speeds associated with it, which maybe turning the fish off. Finally, he may feel a little stronger sense of urgency to strike at a fly sinking and flowing past him than one on the top he can really examine and be picky about.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Riceman wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

You should have bonked 'em with a big articulated streamer Deeter. Done deal. Next...

Riceman

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from jvento wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Size up to an 18 non-parachute pattern and keep the emerger on. Cast and play the waiting game. Let him find your fly instead of presenting it in front of him

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from senglund wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I'd throw something bigger his way so it sticks out a bit.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from cTXn wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Maybe the fish was just camera shy... Try it without the camera on him. If that doesn't work, we're only going to know what you tell us, if you get my drift.

That pun was an accident.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from tourneyking734 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I think that your best bet would probably be using a lightly weighted (with lead wire not split shot) nymph version of that fly. keep your rod lower to the water than usual since the wind is a big factor. Try to fish the fly right beneath the surface or in the film, not on top of the surface scum. I've had similar situations on creeks fishing for brook trout and this worked well. Or you could just skip the small flies altogether and tie on a streamer with a moderate sinking tip. cast it in front of the trout and strip it back with quick jerks and pauses. One of those should work very well on any trout, no matter what the size or species.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from grouse hunter wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I have had this same problem with the fish not even giving the fly a look. I stumbled on to the solution. I had had put on a size 6 foam hopper in desperation. I worked the fish for 30 minutes. I had made a bad cast and the hopper was dragged accross the foam pool, when my line was caught by the current. The Cuttroat I had been trying to catch hit it on that cast. So I found another fish like that downsteam in the foam pool and tried the same thing with the same result. So now when everything else has failed I cast a hopper as close to the bank and don't mend the line and let the hopper get dragged in front of the fish. The Trout hit it aggessively, more like a bass. I have even started to use small mouse pattern and got the same results.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Red wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Not sure about all the conditions or exact bugs coming off, but if your fishing the scum pockets of the Colorado, tie on a spinner pattern of the bug you "think" he's eating, add a long dropper with a smaller spinner pattern and sink it! If he's crusing around in the scum, he might just be after the spent mayflies collecting in the pocket.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Nympho wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

I can't dissagree with the longer, finer tippet theories, but I don't know what he's using and will assume he's tried that. I would tie a spinner pattern on as a second fly, rub it in some muck so it will sink a bit. Spinners are a go to for me in back eddy foam.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from ejunk wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

It looks like, from the video, that you're on the same side of the river as the fish. I assume you're downstream, but it's hard to tell. What I can see is that little ripples are coming in from the left towards the area where the fish was. I think, if possible, would have tried to get in the river (downstream of the fish) and cast into the ripples (which look relatively foam free) and let the fly/flies bob into the zone. I'd also try to slowly pull the flies out of the zone to recast (when it was time) by retrieving line rather than picking up, but you were probably doing that already.

hard to see! take home opinion: it really looks from the video like the bank wasn't the best place to be.

yrs-
Evan!

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from steve182 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

A big ol' nightcrawler?! just kidding

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Big O wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Wrong ? - You told GOD and us your plan and we ALL laughed ! (sorry to easy).
I think sometimes you have to "buck to hatch" and go with a larger "terrestial" to "get their attention".
You should have tried a "hopper". Better luck next time.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from elkslayer wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Put on a larger fly in the same pattern and get rid of the dropper.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from fisherman14 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

In this situation I would put on a hevier fly so that it will be able to sink under the scum. Then it may be more visble for the fish and you would have, possibly, caught it. Also, as elkslayer said, I'd lose the dropper, too.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from muskiemaster wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

fifteen foot fly rod and just drop it on top of him. no I'm just kidding I don't know what you could've done, maybe if I had a 9-foot 5-weight, Temple Fork Outfitters fly rod I could go catch him for you, sometimes luck just isn't on your side.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from silvrtung wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

use somethin a little longer, heavier, and more colerful so u can catch its attention its just eatin somrthin that it sees movin when the waters like that.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from aragonnapoles wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

Why to try just the floaters? as Buckhunter says just under surface one kind of fly never used... the phantom
something in lates 60's...
Never mind I'm sleepping.

+1 Good Comment? | | Report
from coho310 wrote 2 years 15 weeks ago

plan A- Use a medium-sized bass bug or a small wooly bugger. If that fails, lose the floatant and dangle it in his face, the drowned perachute adams (small) usually gets 'em.

plan B- Spinning gear.
{try a small spinner that you can run near the surface}

0 Good Comment? | | Report
from Christian Emter wrote 2 years 14 weeks ago

Try a Dave's grasshopper. It is a cure for non biting trout every time. I have caught alot of rainbows. just by changing to a grasshopper. Another thing to do is to try to catch him on a Panther Martin Spinner. That again is the magic cure for non biting trout.

0 Good Comment? | | Report

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