I agree, the regular mossy oak pattern turns all black at 50 yards. Even in dense broadleaf forest away from dark conifers and shrubs "moldy oak" will silhouette like hell. Some of the newer patterns from the big two camo companies are more basic a light to work in all situations. Like many fishing lures they are mainly designed to fool the hunter not the quarry.

I've bought alot of the Mossy Oak Brush pattern, it's really light, and blends in well. It didn't take commercially, cuz' you can't hardly find the stuff anymore.

My new Mossy Oak Duck Blind jacket works ok in the early waterfowl season, but a month in it becomes WAY too dark. Hoping it fades with use and will be a little more neutral in a few years...

I strongly suggest checking www.optifade.com to learn more about a deer's vision and how we become "nothing" in the eyes of a deer. To quote David "none of them look like anything"...that is absolutely the goal.
As a company, we take concealment very seriously and have committed to going in this direction. Check it out, I think you will all find it quiet interesting.
-Jonathan Hart, Founder, Sitka Gear

I like Cabela's Outfitter camo, too. I never understood why camo makers add all that black. Sit in the woods sometime and look around for something black ... very little, even in the shadows. If I want to imitate the darkness in the shadows then I will move into the shadows and ... voila! Light turns dark.

Good Lord like I need any more reasons to shop for more hunting gear. Mr. Petzal my boyfriend will be thrilled. . .

The ACU pattern is GARBAGE which is why the Army is looking into switching to a "Multicam" pattern that is more similar to the Marines. The new pattern has more browns and tans. I will be happy to throw away all my ACU's and get better uniforms.

Since we now know whitetail deer only have cones in their eyes that repond to blue and green wavelengths of light, has anyone tested what camo works best? (Deer don't have cones sensitive to red (long) wavelengths so see things differently than we do, according to studies at U of Georgia in Aug of 1993)

I'm gonna go with the Alaskan guide I this one; Blue jeans and a BROWN canvas jacket. I'm just askin` since we don't seem to really know WHAT the animals think about all this camo science??

It really cracks me up to see some fella spend all that cash for camo and wears a Orange shirt or Vest over it!

Sounds OXYMORON doesn't it!! LOL!! :)

Dave P,
Whoa. 'So the Marines won't be confused for soldiers'? LOL. Even though I was Army, my son is a Marine so I caught that snide remark. Just kidding, wish I had thought of it.

Mossy Oak Duck Blind is a good camo pattern for the sage and oak brush territory as well as marshy areas. Where I am, there is always a little green vegetation year round.

i would LOVE to wear good camo when rifle deer hunting. but, unfortunately, they sell licenses to anybody who wants one. and most of them have no business in the woods at all. if i had a quarter for every cityboy that comes up to the woods with 3-5 boxes of ammo, and leaves with none, well, i wouldnt be rich, but i could definitly buy a set of the newest and best camo on the market! so, because i do have kids, that NEED a father, i wear orange. and hopefully, the idiots in the woods, still will not mistake me for an animal they can shoot.

Uf-dah !! Yowzer and Holly smoke,.. Petzal takes a swing at The Marines on veterns days just after their birthday (241?)
Thats B@lls,.. and other words Im not qualified to use.

Clay : your story about bending over,. then standing up quickly,.. thats right I did that
On the advice of an old timer up in Wi (many moons ago ) ,.. Got caught out in he open ,. was trying to move into treeline then crawl,.. three deer ,.. medium buck and two does ,.. the darn does started trotting right at me !!!,.. didnt even make the woods ,. they circled just out of bow range got my sent and as they say,. thats all folks.

But it also reminds me of taking a green horn goose hunting mid 80's In Central WI
Cold day,. windy,. clouds scudding,.. no snow yet,. still wet but ground was getting hard ,..we were 40 yds apart in small blinds ,. explained to the new guy
Just keep an eye on me,. if I get down you too Ok ? or if you see some coming from down river just duck down,.
I will see you OK ? Ok says the new guy ,.. well it wasn't a goosey morning so about 10;30 we called it quits ,..the new guy burned most a box of shells on some high flyers ,..and one guy in our bunch whacked a mallard with a 10 ga but that was the extent of the exitement.
On the way back I was talking to the new guy
and I said jeeze sorry ,. was really hoping to get you you into some birds this morning but we still have this afternona and tommrow ,.
He says hey no problem Yo,..I had fun,.
Walking behind him when the path got narrow I noticed the back of his jacket was wet and muddy so I asked him ,. how he managed to get wet that high up,..

Here is what he said,.. well you told me to watch you right ? I said yup ,. and he said ,. so i did ,.
evry time you went down I went down and when I saw you getting up I figure safe to stand ,.. perfect I said, but how? He said well here's what happened
About 9;30 I had shot a about ten times and couldnt scratch one down,.I said ya they were too high.
Was trying to signal that but since you were new figured you just had to shoot to find out ,..He ssys well guess thats right,. but now I know how hi NOT to shoot
Yup says I ,. But how in rhe " H " did you get wet between the shoulder blades .
He says I was watching you and geese were coming from my side. Then about every two seconds you were up ,. then down,.. up & down,... ,
I thouht maybe 10,000 geese were coming from your direction.. I was watching for the geese and you going up and down and I ws going up and down then I heard birds behind me
by the time the damn birds got there i was dizzy from going up and down ,wacthing you and watching for all the damn geese if figured were coming
You didnt shoot at the ones I cold see ( said yup to high
so I pulled both triggers (he had a Spanish 10 ga dbl) and it knocked me over backward,.. YUK YUK

The birds were too high,. I knew that
it was getting colder and colder
,. so I ( Yohan ) was doing deep knee bends to warm up.
He,. the new guy being the dutiful new guy did what i did,.
Because thats what I asked him to do. I remember distuictly that day I did 50 knee bends more than half way through the 50 he shot and fell over ,..

When the other guys ( all experianced goose hunetrs) heard that every one came very close to stroke by laughter .
That night one guy after the obligitory two Manhatens had to go outside he was laughing so hard.
It was a running joke from then on. He would call and say
Yo ,. wanna take a trip to the river,. do sonme deep knee bends ?? Maybe even shoot some Geese?,.

The optifade camou sounds good for hunting in the open areas of the west. BUT, for bowhunting Mossy oak does a good job in the woods were most deer are up close when you first see them. When I'm using a 25-06 and wearing orange camou isn't an issue 'cause I'm usually in wide open spaces.
BTW, Beekeeper's plane is due to land at KCI in about an hour. We will soon be on the road to Ulysses, Kansas along with Billy D, and Taxidermist Dan Snowbarger. Hopefully Jill and Buck will find plenty of long tailed roosters for us to shoot.
Yesterday I saw another huge Kansas buck in a park where he is safe. About a 150-160 inch 8 pointer, he looked pretty old too.

As to camo ,.. for deer ,. and elk
and moose
Blaze orange (no pattern) shell to go over good gortex coat and layers
Blaze orange hat ( I prefer balaclava ) but stormy Chromer ,. ect etc If really cold head sock then hat
Surplus ( O D) German army winter pants ,.
Very heavy wool with plastic liners in the knees,.roomy cut lots of pockets .
Not what you run a marathon in but warm ?? and walk for ever in those.
Only thing even close commercially (that I know of) is the heavy "Malone Pants" and they still dont measure up. . Warm even when wet too.
With outline broken have had the nervous ones (deer) walk right up to me with that combination,.. didnt know a thing unless or until they smelled me or I shot em .
And other people see plain bright blaze orange better than blaze orange cammo.

Be careful firing a verbal shot at the USMC Dave.
I agree 100% on the Cabela's Outfitter style camo. It really blends in just about anywhere except snow. I have it in wool, and it is great.

I have a mixed bag of camo clothing, and i'll be damned if i know which is which as far as "namebrands" or whatever. They all work to some degree if you're still, and downwind of your target, in my opinion. When you're moving, no camo is very effective, in my opinion.

Clay, don't do that here in Ky. on opening day. You could get busted, I mean Busted....

Speaking as a "jarhead", no offense taken, Dave. Besides, by the time the enemy gets close enough to see the little eagles, globes and anchors, they're well on the way to the 70 virgins they've been promised...though I suspect that'll be another disappointment for them.
I will add, I wore woodland camouflage on a training exercise at Fort McCoy in 1985, and a mature buck walked right toward, pausing a few feet away from me, as I was partially buried in leaves. That certainly increased my appreciation of that pattern's effectiveness!

Sarge
One of the things about hunting or fishing but hunting in particular is the crazy sh!T that happens YUK YUK

I would have then,. and would now,. pay the price of admintion to see a biggun eyein up your B-hind ,.
Christ just the thought of it nearly enough to bring tears to my eyes .

I'have shot alot of deer,. over 100,.(significantly over)
biggest one was with 30-30 at 40 yd +/- yds dressed at just about 215 lb,..but he had hung four days before we got him ona scale.so to say 250 on the hoof probbaly pretty close.
Still the bigest damn deer I ever saw in my life was farm country whitetail buck ( south west wi) ,..that deer would simply dworf the one I just metioned which by the way was a big woods deer.

Now the yuks ,.Only reason that deer isn't on the wall is that I had been sitting most of the morning.
So decided to move to a differnt stand ,.
Half way there the uge was too great,. set my gun against a tree and began the proces of finding my "Johnson" under 14 layers. ( it was really cold that morning )
I had just begun the process of utmost reliefe when the big SOB walked out of the thick stuff 20 yds away and just stared at me ,.. couldnt stop,. so I just looked back peed at him,..saying there take that,. you big lucky b@stard YUK YUK
He took umbridge at that where upon he made his exit .

As to your wife I am certain she is a wounderfull woman
Yet women in their invironment being genetically programed for untold malinia to blend in when gathering frits nuts ,. bring an abilty men
just dont posses when it comes to camaoflaging or just plain dissapearing in shops and stores ,.IE places to spend money ,. thetrade off is the good ones tolrate us and the bad ones we run like hell from.

Thank yo sir,. the vision of a big deer putting the bullsye on you butt is quiet entertaining ,. disturbing to be honest ,. but entertaining none the less.

No longer hunt with my brother ,. which his a shame
But do some how to his becomeing a universal expert on evrthing in te entie F cking univers,.. it got to be to much work,..Still before he did assme that mantel
when we hunted together I did as much lauging as hunting.

I wonder if the 70 virgins are 70 year old Christian nuns.

shane

I assume you meant Catholic nuns.

I don't think the guys expecting young Muslim virgins differentiate. All infidels.

I keep several patterns for seasonal variations in the local vegetation. A new pattern that is a year or so old is the Cairn's Multi-cam. It is a multi enviroment camoflage and Propper and Mil-Spec make BDU style jackets and pants in that pattern. It reminds me of a cross between Woodland patterns (not colors), and flectarn. The colors are a blend of a light green, olive tan, and light brown. When one looks at it one can see how it could work in both a wooded or desert environment.
When the leaves are still up, it's hard to beat the original Vietnam tiger stripe (adviser pattern). It really comes into its own in areas with any type of wild grasses. We are required to wear an orange hat in my state for deer hunting, but if the truth be known, when hunting private property and back in the woods up 20' in a tree stand the orange hat comes off and the boonie hat goes on. When finished hunting, before climbing down and heading out of the woods, the orange hat goes back on.
Deer do look up.

Ejunk - Cabela's does sell outfitter in Microtex and Microtex Lite. Both are great. And I agree, Outfitter is a great, versatile pattern that is effective anywhere in the country.

I am enjoying this discussion about the pros/cons of different patterns.

I figured out over the years that for many patterns, they are different only so a company can patent them and charge accordingly. "RealTree", "Mossy Oak", and others do the same thing (or try to), and make it a personal choice. Just like ASAT (All Situation - All Terrain) did a few decades ago.

Even the military has to have 2 or three patterns at once. Especially for those who are out there on the pointy end of the spear, they need the best. There's a big difference between hiding from a deer and hiding from an extremist.

If there was ONE proven-most-effective pattern, I bet some company would have cashed in on it years ago.

I personally wear some orange now, after a close call of a friend many years ago.

But I want to take a look at some of the suggestions here. Good ideas.

It all depends on where and how you hunt, my preferred tactic is to find a fairly big pine tree with thick hanging to the ground limbs. I'll crawl under the branches and cut out some branches to give myself a V shaped area to sit against the trunk and open up some shooting ports in the limbs, it is a natural ground blind when I'm done. I wear a dark green and black camo coat and brown camo pants. The coat blends in with the green and almost black interior of the tree and the pants blend into the basic brown pine needles on the ground. Have had both deer and hunters pass right by me without ever knowing I was there.

I usually prep a few trees in an area before deer season so I can move around as needed. Also a good thing that if it snows the tree blocks most of it from me, as well as wind. Pack a Plastic trash bag to sit on or plan on a wet butt, guess you could use a small folding seat or bucket but you would have to cut more limbs for the greater sitting height, and it's more to lug into the woods.

awsome

I currently have 2 "homes" for hunting, the first where I started and my parents still live in WA, and where I now live in TX. The "camo" I have for the first is some old army wool pants (OD Green)and Red plaid wool sirts and coats for a hat I have a red "crusher" felt hat. Since it is significantly warmer here in TX I invested in a pair of Cabela's Seclusion 3D pants and they worked well enough last year with the same shirts and a grey Stetson. I had young buck at about 20 yds trying to decide just what I was before I shot the 9 point with him. This year I bought an Advantage Max 1 shirt since it seems to be patterend after the terrain I hunt here, mesquite and cedar. I also got a RealTree ball-cap at K-Mart for about $5. The only thing I refuse to hunt in is denim because it is just too noisy. Silence, scent, and stillness are still the best methods of camoflage. As for scent wool is probably the best, you get is soaked and you just smell like an old sheep.