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Petzal: Why I Hate Detachable Magazines

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September 09, 2009

Petzal: Why I Hate Detachable Magazines

By David E. Petzal

In the course of this blog I’ve said many unkind things about detachable magazines and I meant every word I said. It has dismayed me to see detachable magazine on some very fine and high-priced rifles whose makers should know better, but it seems that the industry trend is toward them. So I was elated to see, on p. 251 of Craig Boddington’s brand new book Safari Rifles II, the following:

“Personally, I’ve never understood what place a detachable magazine has on a hunting rifle. They are one of my pet peeves, just something else to look after and possibly lose.”

Say amen. There’s only one rational reason to design a rifle with a detachable magazine, and that is for military use, where you have to stuff as many rounds in the gun as quickly as you can.

Here is why I dislike detachable magazines.

Very often, either because they are defective in design or manufacture, or because you didn’t shove them in all the way, they fall to the ground where they break, are lost, or become so loaded up with dirt or snow that you now have a single-shot.

They add to the weight of a gun.

You can lose them.

A stock with a cutout for a detachable magazine is less rigid than a stock with a blind magazine.

Hinged floorplates pop open accidentally, but all you lose are your cartridges.

I’ve heard it said that detachable magazines “…make it easier to load and unload your rifle.” True, but how hard is it to cycle three cartridges through the action or drop a floorplate? If you have trouble performing either of these tasks, perhaps you should not be using a rifle in the first place.

Anything that’s not essential and which opens the door to malfunctions is something that I can do without quite nicely.

Comments (93)

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Amen. Aside from autoloaders, they are as useful as teats on a bull, which (said autoloader) are next to the teats for a hunting rifle. JMHO

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from general dethcoff wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree with your beef that a detachable magazine makes the stock less rigid and that the detachable magazine is easier to lose. However, on a blind magazine when you have to remove the same cartridges over and over again as I often do, the the tips of my bullets get all mashed up making me worry about their accuracy. I shoot .300 WSM winchester 180 grain CXP 3's out of my savage model 112. any advice?

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from general dethcoff wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

An AR style rifle in .260 or .308 is an excellent deer hunting rifle with a detachable magazine.

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from westkybanded wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I'm sure you also subscribe to the belief that such weapons only belong on foreign battlefields? Live and let live.

-1 Good Comment? | | Report
from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Occasionally I hunt with a M1A with absolutely no magazine problem with the exception to additional bulk and weight. I fully agree magazines can be something else to look after and possibly lose. I remember a Fella sitting on his stand with a Remington auto and when he raised and fired the Mag was in his lap! It’s really hard to miss and lose a M1A Mag compared to a Remington 4 rounder!

+6 Good Comment? | | Report
from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Bottom line

If you have quality equipment and maintain it properly, they function flawlessly!

+10 Good Comment? | | Report
from sgaredneck wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

For a bolt action I agree 100% on those d@%# detachable mags. If there was only change I could make on my Tikka T3 it would be that silly plastic mag. Lose one, and try to buy one of those and you will get angry over the cost of said silly piece of plastic. I know I've heard all the arguments about how great polymers are and I've seen the youtube videos of the AR pmag getting run over by a truck. I look at my Husqvarna 8x57 Mauser and I think they had it right way back when.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mark-1 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I have no use for a detach mag on a bolt action hunting rifle, either. The only rationale is a need to toss a bunch of lead down range. Few hunting situations are such.

As said one more item to feed Murphy's Law.

+7 Good Comment? | | Report
from MLH wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Loading and unloading a blind magazine in the cold and dark is a pain in the butt. Can easily drop cartridges. When unloaded, need to put them somewhere, preferably in a pretty leather bullet carrier that has to be dug out of a pocket or pack or carried on a belt or stock. On blind or hinged floorplate guns fixed blade ejectors are nice.

Box mags are handy to remove and put into a pack or coat pocket - nice and orderly and protect bullet tips. I've have guns with box mags that are as hunting accurate as guns with blind mags or hinged floorplates, so the extra strength of a full stock doesn't carry any water with me. For deer hunting box mags are near perfect.

If I were to go after dangerous game where I had to minimize the chance of anything going wrong, then no mag (double) makes a whole lot of sense. So, why not just say to hell with mags altogether?

And mags work just fine in my pistols, though I prefer revolvers for hunting. And while we are on it, loading and unloading single action revolvers is a pain in the butt ....

+7 Good Comment? | | Report
from Walt Smith wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I personaly like the detachable magazine on my remington 740, I like the fact that I don't have to mash my $50.00 a box ammo through my action,every day, knocking off the points and screwing up my expensive bullets accuracy. But I'm sure there is something nostalgic about running your ammo thru your action everynight when you didn't get a chance to shoot that might make the old timers feel better. Ha Ha.

+7 Good Comment? | | Report
from seadog wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Once again, I find myself in the middle. I don't think a detachable mag is an advantage on a hunting rifle for any type of legal hunting that most of us do. But some AR style weapons make good hunting rifles and some hunters like using them. I don't use them, but I don't want to see my right or anyone else's right to use them taken away. (I realize that Dave's point is only that we shouldn't--not that we shouldn't have the right.)

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from MLH wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

By the way, Boddington has a very nice Winchester 88 in .358 Win. I know it is customized but was it converted to a blind mag or hinged floorplate?

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from country road wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Box mags are unnecessary in hunting rifles as far as I'm concerned. I have a Wichester with a box magazine and I carry it in my coat pocket where it collects lint, twigs, dust and other assorted detritus. If I had an autoloader, I'd want the extra mag, but for my hunting, the blind magazines on my other rifles work just fine and as has been said, is one less thing to lose or go wrong.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I loaded many a detachable/box magazine in the cold, dark, rain, and snow in my 7 years, 9 months, and 21 days in this man's Army and blind/florplate ones all the years hunting since. Loading a blind magazine or a detachable magazine can be a challenge for the fumble fingered, scared, nervous, or climate challenged. Either is another "chance to excel" as we used to say. Training and practice can overcome!

For the average hunter: KISS

+5 Good Comment? | | Report
from Mike Diehl wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

The presence or absence of a detachable mag is not a selling point for me. I can't see the urgent need for one in the hunting field. What're you gonna do? Suppressing fire on that deer?

I have a Ruger and I like the drop out floorplate. I have another rifle that has a rotary magazine -- you just press a button and all the bullets leap into your hand. I like that even more but understand that magazine design is rather expensive to manufacture.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from crm3006 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I will add my Amen to DEP's detestation of detachable magazines. I have exactly one rifle with such an abomination, and it is a Kimber .22 LR. Not a dangerous game gun, unless you encounter a charging rabbit. The squirt gun (M1A), of course, has a detachable
magazine, but that was developed by John C. Garand for military use, and I have never seen one properly locked in that failed. As to cycling rounds through the action, what is wrong with simply pressing down the rounds and closing the bolt on an empty chamber? I carry a rifle like this a lot on the lease, and when it is time to load, you simply bolt the action. Saves noise and wear and tear on bullet noses. I realize that this won't work in all situations due to "loaded firearms" laws in some jurisdictions, but it should work on a hunting lease. If the chamber is empty and the firing pin is down it is unloaded, right? As to hinged floor plates, they are convenient, but tend to fail at inconvenient times. I have had one dump cartridges on the ground for me, and tend to inspect them carefully and have had one sealed. I like the blind magazines, except on the M1A.

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from ishawooa wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Obviously some types of rifles require a box magazine or "clip" such as the ARs and commercial semi-autos. Perhaps Browning offered the best design for the sportsman who wants to use such a rifle back in the late sixties when they marketed the BAR with a removable box magazine which attached to the dropping floor plate. Not the quickest for reloading but it does offer the majority of the advantages previously stated by you guys. Frankly I have bellowed loud and long in the past about my dislike for box magazines on bolt action rifles. If per chance you do lose the magazine 25 miles from pavement you have a rifle that is a single shot which is difficult to reload in a hurry. I don't like the blind magazine much except that it offers a superior external appearance and there is no freezing cold magazine floorplate to stick to your hand when you least want it. Regardless I mainly just stick to the good old fashioned built in magazine that swings open to drop my unused cartridges. If you are worried about it accidently opening and dropping your cartridges during the hunt a piece of duct tape will eliminate the problem. A gunsmith can also tighten the latching mechanism. Just to carry things a bit further I also admire single shot rifles like Dakotas and No. 1s. I have never owned either. As I see it the shooter of a single shot does have a magazine be it an extra cartridge in his forearm hand, in loops on his sling, perhaps in loops sewed to the shoulder of his jacket, in a pouch on his belt, or whatever so there is some possibility of getting that cartridge in the barrel for a quick followup that we all will need sooner or later for whatever reason. To each his own, that's why they make and sell all these designs in an effort to please at least some of us. Pick and use what you like...
Mike D: Those rotary magazines are fantastic, sure wish they were more readily available. I understand that indeed they are expensive to manufacture and somewhat difficult to clean. However Ruger seems to overcome both problems with the as-issued 10/22 rotary version which has been around for about fifty years. As I remember you are one of the blessed individuals who has a Mann-Sch which I assume has the rotary in no doubt a classic caliber. What an enjoyable rifle that must be.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from steve182 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

If you need to reload that fast while hunting, you should spend some more time on the range. Neither of my deer rifles feature detatchable magazines or hinged floor-plates.

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from WVOtter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

My dad has a nice old 22 Hornet that was his uncles, and I've hunted with it a few times myself...and that darn magazine catches on sleeves and fingers and wants to come out at the drop of a hat. Not to mention it's so loose, it doesn't line the round up with the bolt; so you have to apply pressure to the mag with one hand and close the bolt with the other. Big pain...I'd rather deal with loading and unloading every time I leave/return to the truck than that...especially on an antique sentimental rifle.

+3 Good Comment? | | Report
from crm3006 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Clay Cooper-
FYI- I have a 5 round mag. from Springfield
Armory that cuts down a lot of the bulk on my
MIA for hunting purposes. It does take a little finagling to get it out of the well, but I'm hoping it will loosen up with a little wear.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Devil_Dog wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I for one like detachable magazines. No wear on the rounds, quick and simple to load/ unload the rifle, and more importantly to me, easier to clean the rifle's belly. Hinged floorplates aren't bad for this, but I don't want to have to pull a stock off a blind magazine everytime I hunt in wet weather to make sure my rifle's guts stay clean. And yes it takes a little extra work to clean a magazine, but it's still alot easier than pulling a stock off. And as for accuracy, I want minute of deer out to 300 yards. My Rem7600 does this just fine.

+6 Good Comment? | | Report
from Bernie wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree with Dave on detachable magazines on a big game rifle--they are abominations and do nothing to add to the attractiveness of the rifle. All my center-fire rifles have hinged floorplates, and while I have heard stories about them giving way and dropping one's cartridges into the dirt or snow, it mercifully has never happened to me. That is after using rifles made by Sako, Winchester, Remington, Ruger and Weatherby. Maybe I have just been lucky.

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from vtbluegrass wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

What the hell is wrong with the actions on your rifles thats its tearing up bullet noses? Seriously people

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from albertahunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I love my Remington 30-06 semiauto with its clips. I have far more expensive and larger guns but its this one that now gets used the most. I can have a clip of premium bullets and two of cheapos for coyotes/wolves. I dont lose bullets in the snow dumping a floorplate as here u cannot have ammo in a gun in vehicle. And the semi auto has anchored many of our large WT with that quick second shot without losing line of sight and I have the racks to prove it. Just my opinion of course.

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from Ruckweiler wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Never had any problems with magazines on my M-16A1. Training makes all the difference and always will.

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from Jim in Mo wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

If I had the knowledge of a young computer geek I would link this site to the East Central Missouri Black Baptist Choir and we could all join in a beautiful rendition of "Aahmen, Aahmen, Aaahahmen Aahmen Aahmen".
Sing It Louder Brother!

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from O Garcia wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

the detachable mags on hunting rifles have the same capacity or in the case of the Blaser, even less than that of the hinged floorplate fixed magazine types. So I don't understand the suppressing fire comment from Mike Diehl, except perhaps if he meant the fast reloads detachables allow, assuming you have spare magazines. Otherwise, if you only have one magazine, there's really no firepower advantage to the detachable.

I think John Barsness wrote when reviewing the Browning A-Bolt that his wife prefers the A-Bolt because with her weaker fingers (apologies to the huntresses reading), she finds she could load cartridges on the Browning detachable better than on a fixed magazine rifle. So there's some merit to some detachables, at least to the Browning. And it also attaches with reasonable security to a floorplate, so it's not so easy to lose.

The merits of a detachable magazine on military rifles is obvious. Even on bolt action sniper rifles, detachables are gaining ground. If you have a round in the chamber but would like to top up, you could keep the bolt in battery, ready to fire on the enemy, while inserting a fresh, full mag (or, again, if you only carry one mag, topping it up with fresh rounds). The detachable also makes it easier to load a scoped bolt rifle, and when you see the scope bases/mounts being used by Marines on those modified Remington 700s, you know they crowd into the loading/ejection port making it really tight. Obviously, if you're a sniper worth your badge, you won't need to reload fast, but even the best snipers can be surprised, and then they have to fire really fast and reload. Yeah, this is also the reason why the semi-auto sniper rifle is once again being considered.

Probably the best military bolt action rifle of all time, when you throw out all the romanticism attached to the Mauser, is the British Lee-Enfield. It featured a detachable magazine that was used by the British NOT as a detachable, but as a fixed. They loaded it from the top with stripper clips. Adds nothing to the discussion, but I thought I'd throw it in.

+7 Good Comment? | | Report
from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I never owned a rifle with anything but a tubular magazine until this past spring. I purchased a BLR in 300WinMag. (Finally got it!) The detachable box mag was defective -- wouldn't cycle the first round -- and had to be sent back to the factory... (I'd have just sent me a new one...)

Never the less, I was out in the woods today and in Washington State it is illegal to have a loaded rifle in the car. So I must admit it was pretty darn convenient to not have to cycle anything -- just pop! and the mag and bullets went on the dash! Seems pretty alright to me! -- so far...

+5 Good Comment? | | Report
from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Carney

You're not one of those toad, I mean road, hunters are you?

+2 Good Comment? | | Report
from butterbean wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

IT all boils down to one thing. If it is a machanical device it must be cleaned and inspected on a regular basis. Magazines are used in some of the worst enviroments in the world and work very well. The same is said for bolt action and blind magazine guns. I happen to like both. If you let any of them get dirty and full of junk they will eventually fail

+4 Good Comment? | | Report
from AlaskanExile wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree with Dr. Petzal on this one. Detachable magazines are nothing but trouble on a hunting rifle.I have a buddy who has hunted since his teen years (he's early 40's) with a Remington 760 pump, but sold it last fall without a magazine, after it dropped out the "last" magazine on a mule deer hunt. He had lost close to 10 over the course of his life, and had hit the end of the road.
I have a Remington 788 that uses unavailable magazines (no one makes them, especially not Remington) I've turned down offers of $60 ea for my spares because they are irreplaceable. I was lucky enough to find those at a gun show. They can, and do fall out in the field and are slow to change. A blind magazine would be better.
I have a Browning A-Bolt 7Mag, that has probably the best detachable magazine ever, I agree with Barsness and O'Garcia on that. Best detachable mag hunting rifle; that's kind of like being the skinniest kid at fat-camp. The A-Bolt uses a box magazine that you must attach to the floorplate while it's open, then close it with the box attached. It's not the quickest reload, but you can load it through the port like a blind magazine, and you can drop a round on top of the follower and just slam it home too.
It is a hard piece of gear to lose(drop), but still possible to forget it at home. I have gotten to the range without it before, and that is really a drag when that rifle was the reason I was going shooting. If I got to a faraway hunting camp without it I would be in a rough spot. Replacements only come from Browning and retail for nearly $60 with shipping.
I never forget the magazine for my Savage. Idiot proof; best for me.
Just my two-cents
AKX

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from olsingleshot wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

So in other words if you lose your magazine it is the rifle's fault? What if you lose your ammo, is it the rifles fault? I have several types of rifles with all different types of feeding. A magazine is the easiest, fastest, safest way to load a rifle. Do you own a semi-auto pistol, do you lose the magazine? I don't think so. If you cannot adapt to a magazine, it is not the design of the rifles proble, it's yours.

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from nunyabinis wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I felt the same way about detachable mags until I got my first Browning X-Bolt. That thing's slicker'n snot. I liked it so much I now own two X-Bolts.

As to affecting the stiffness/accuracy of the rifle, both my X-Bolts are tack drivers. WAY more accurate than I am.

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from MidMichHunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

After 30+ post, I'd think more people would have mentioned the cost associated with the damn box mags. AlaskanExile did, and I agree with him. I have a Browning A-Bolt as well, and the thought of dropping $60 to get a spare box mag kills me, because I also need a spare for my Browning BLR as well. So $120 extra just to cover my butt in case I loose one, that's hard to take. I wish I knew this before I bought the A-Bolt, which was my first rifle and my BLR which was my second. I guess ignorance is truly bliss..

Oh, BTW, why do the mags cost so much, there doesn't seem to be too much to them.

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from AlaskanExile wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

OlSingleshot;
I didn't say I couldn't adapt, I hunt with rifles that use them. I said detachable magazines were trouble. Extra trouble that I don't need when I'm trying to enjoy myself and go shooting or go hunting.
The Remington pump and autoloader magazines have a nasty habit of hanging in there after the release catch has been pressed, then they fall out later, down the trail. If you don't see, hear or feel it drop into the snow, it's gone. My friend sold his rifle because he was tired of losing magazines.
I own several semiauto pistols and have special pouches to keep the magazines in. I have lost magazines in the field for my autoloading pistol. Those magazines are available for less than $30, not expensive or difficult to replace, my 788 Remington is another story.
Blind Magazine=less to go wrong.
If you like detachable magazines, that's great, I wish my 788 had a blind magazine, that's all.
AKX

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from evadbuck wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I like both options. I have a very reliable Remington 742 Woodsman with detatchable in .308 and a fantastic Winchester model 70 classic sporter LT in .264 Win Mag with a hinged floor plate and I am ever so careful when unloading, sure takes time and care, but these were my Grandfathers work horses for years in the field and neither ever let him down.

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from naco96 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Right on nunyabinis... the detachable mags in my X-bolts (25-06 and 270WSM)are are great and have never missed a beat. And yes mine are tack drivers as well. I think Dave has been out in the sun a bit too long because I think I remember him saying in one of his early reviews that the detachable mag of the x-bolt was one of its most positive features.
Of course if one is speaking of magazines, in my admittedly less than professional opinion, nothing beats the rotary in my model 1899 Savage 303!

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from sarg wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree 100%, I don't like Detachable mags on hunting rifles . I don't realy care much about Floorplates either. I don't like anything under a rifle stock. Someone said their bullets get boogered up when unloading with a rifle without a mag or floor plate, I have never had anthing like that to happen, but I've always hunted with a Rem. ADL, what do people do, stand in the middle of the road and eject their bullet in the road? Why add more probles to something when it's not necessary?

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from Beekeeper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

My wife loves the convenience of the Browing style hinged floor plate/detachable clip of her A-Bolt Micro Hunter. This is the same type rig that Ish described above on the BAR. Shortly after I bought her the rifle a local gun dealer went belly up and had a big rummage sale on what was left after the creditors got their share. What did I find other than a treasure trove of Browning bases and rings for all kinds of stuff? Why a collection of the short action detachable A-Bolt "clips" tho fit her rifle. I paid $5 each for all 5. Sticker price had been $40 each. As a friend of mine would say, "What a bargain!"

Guess what Dave? In 4 years she has already lost 3 of the 5! I still have one of the 5 where she can't find it, in the glove box of my truck! Just in case she should need it some day when we get to the woods...

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from z41 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Dave, "Hinged floorplates pop open accidentally, but all you lose are your cartridges." What more is there to lose, you've lost it all.

It's a personal perference thing you can build a case on either side - it's where your affection is.

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from AlaskanExile wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I have to correct myself. Just for kicks, I checked on Gunbroker and found a few magazines for 788's. Most any calibers are available there and some appear to be new from Remington. I don't know if they are new old stock or actually new magazines.
A few years ago when my rifle was sitting (for about a year) in a gunsmith's shop waiting for a new barrel, he got offers several times to buy my magazines for up to $60 each. He said Remington hadn't made those in years and nobody in the aftermarket had either.

Beekeeper: That's quite a score to get 5 for $5 each.
AKX

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from nelsol wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Detachable magazines---I love them. Browning A-bolt, never a problem with the detachable box magazine. Carry a spare in my pocket. Never had the need to reload in the field. If you can't get by with 4 rounds, you probably need more practice.
Ever lose a 1911, Glock, Sig, S&W mag for autoloaders? No, you keep them where they belong, either in the weapon or in a mag case on your belt where they are easily accessable. Same can be said for the speed loaders for revolvers. Keep up with your stuff--just like your truck keys, your wallet, or your woman.
It's never the gun, it's the nut behind the butt.

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from beardedfarmer wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

beardedfarmer
Alot of the coments I read are from other than those of us that use over the counter "MEAT" guns. I have a model 7 Remington that the clip an excellent idea. Most of us shoot once or twice a year at game than 2 or 3 to see if the front iron sight has been knocked out alingment. Our grouping is 4 to 6 inches. Enough to kill and not leave a wounded animal in the woods. The one thing that affects out shot more than any thing is the nose of the bullet being knocked out of its original shape. So we use a clip, keep it in shape and that keeps the bullets in shape.

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from wingshooter54 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Remington stayed on my s**t list for many years because they took their fine Model 700 Mountain rifle and turned it into a detachable magazine piece of crap. It ruined the lines of the stock and the total looks of the gun. Why they ever stopped making this model of 700 is beyond me, but Remington has a track record of stupidly dropping guns from their line; Remington 32 (Kreighoff made a killing out of that one!!) Model 3200 - one of the best competition shotguns ever, anywhere, Nylon 66, etc. If you can find an original 700 mountain rifle in 280, 7x57, or 257 Roberts you will pay a premium, but have a great rifle. My present one is a Model 700 mountain stainless/laminate in .260 Remington -- about as good as it gets.
Michael

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from Zermoid wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I got to say I prefer detachable mags, carrying extra mags beats carrying extra loose ammo and then having to stuff said ammo into the gun wearing bulky gloves. (gets near zero here in deer season, you don't go gloveless)
Popping out an empty mag and replacing it with a full one is easier, and the mag is harder to lose if you drop it then the loose ammo. (scatter a few rounds in a foot or so of snow and have fun trying to find them) I personally have had trouble with mags dropping on their own only once, a Universal M1 Carbine that did not like military surplus 30 rounders. Worked fine with commercial mfg ones though, go figure.

My Swedish Mauser has the original box mag, altho I did alter the follower to allow closing the bolt with an empty mag. The one thing that always bothers me is the fact that as soon as I close the bolt the rifle is 1 round short in the mag. I'm sorry but it bugs me. I can't top off the mag and put it back in like a detachable. Yes I am picky about stuff like that.
Also as mentioned before running these rounds thru the action repeatedly does damage the bullet tips, which worries me if I need to take a long range shot. Especially since it's my long range rifle, if I plan on woods hunting I take the Marlin 30-30, fields or more open areas and I take the Swede, or as my kids call it, the cannon.

I wish I could hunt with a semi in PA, but all firearms must be "manually operated" here. Yes, it sucks.
If this ever changes I'd love to take my SKS out hunting, it's very accurate with open sights, if I added a scope it would probably be MOA or better. And I have a 5, 10 and 20 round box mags for it as well as 30 round detachables to fit it.

Does anybody remember the SKS scope mounts they had years ago, that you had to drill and tap the side of the receiver to mount? I don't trust the cover mounted ones myself, I want it connected to something that don't move! Anyone know if and where I might be able to find one? I haven't seen them for years.

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from JCB wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

The detachable has a place in the vehicle. The road hunters need a detachable magazine so they can unload the gun fast, before the game warden pulls them over.

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from Jeff Bowers wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

It seems that for once I have avoided Dave's ire.

After 22 years in the military, I have to think I just got tired of cleaning and maintaining all that stuff. I only have Remington ADLs and revolvers. I actually have to now think about why that is.

I used to have magazine-fed weapons and despised the cost. When H&K 91 mags hit $100 I quit looking at them. I later sold the rifle. I worried about any tube-fed rifle because I worried about a round up against the next primer. I think you use special rounds for those but I didn't want to have to sort ammo that way. Just lazy, I guess.

So I'm happy with the simple life now, but I do understand the attraction of magazines to some people. They are quick to reload, hold ungodly amounts of rounds, and are pretty cool.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

@JCB

LMAO!

@ Carney
Seen any blue light specials lately? LOL

Just kidding!

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from ggmack wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

alright i keep a ruger mini 14 with an extra mag taped to the off side of the stock in the back of my truck as a JIC gun. but when I know i will be shooting i take my A303 so yes i use a detachable mag but my first choice is a blind mag.

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from Jere Smith wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

The only time I used Detachable magazines was in the Army, after they did away with the best combat weapon ever! Changing the M-1 Garand to the M-14 then compounding the error with a POS called and AR 15/M16. Hated both of them, then they changed out the Best Pistol ever the 1911A1 for Barf!, a 9 MM Berreta 92 so the troops instead of actually having to aim and fire could use the "Spray & Pray" method of marksmanship! Happily Spec Ops people have more sense than that. And .45's are back in the system and the Barrett is in play. As well as some other more useful weapons. I never lost a magazine even in VIet Nam or other places I happened to be. But don't really care for them. JMNSVHO!

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

crm3006

M1A with a 5 round mag and 5 round stripper clip works fantastic, you can reload faster than anyone in the field where mag capacity is limited to 5!

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from Ralph the Rifleman wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Gotta agree with Petzal on this issue; I don't like detach mags; WITH THE EXCEPTION of the AR and M-14 design firearms that are just perfect the way they are with a detachable magazine!
I will take issue to added weight since most modern mags are plastic that don't add much weight.

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from jbird wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

My Dad hunted w/ a Savage 30-06 for 40 years, problems he had with the detachable mag---- 0.

I've hunted w/ a pre-64 Mod 70 .270 for 19 years, problems I've had w/ the hinged floorplate---- 0!

My Grandpa hunted with the same Mod. 70 for 40 years before giving it to me, problems he had w/ the hinged floorplate----- 0!

That's 99 years of hunting w/ detachable mags/hinged floorplates with NO malfunctions, I guess I just don't get what the problem is?????

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

WAMountainHunter,

Nope -- not a road hunter during deer or elk season but scouting ahead of the season is a different story.

SO, let me tell you about my time in the woods yesterday. Finished a construction project by 1PM and took the rest of the day off. Headed out Road 42 in the Gifford Pinchot National Forest with my 15 year old son. The road climbs from 800ft to 3200ft where road 53 splits off and rides the ridges of mountains sloped with some of the most dense evergreen forest and impenetrable undergrowth.

Right now, bear is the only big game in season, but coyote, bobcat, forest grouse, rabbit -- and other things that I haven't ever seen in our woods are legal...

As Road 53 pushes past Saturday Rock and climbs to 3500 ft, one can be surprised at the amount of coyote scat dropped on the road. When it's fresh and there's a decent place to pull off, we step out push up or down the mountain to set up and call for coyote! (The first time they came to the call I had my Marlin 1895 with that stupid cross bolt safety. Pulled the hammer out of half cock, pressed the trigger and heard that mind scrambling "plank!". By the time the safety was off we were busted and I couldn't find them in the scope again fast enough...)

If there's no action, we head back to the van unload and move along. At the least, we've observed more of what's going on in the woods in that particular canyon or ridge.

Yesterday we parked at the base of the western peak of the Tatoosh Hills. Climbed through the rough woods looking for fresh sign of anything. Feasted on huckleberries and pushed past the forest toward the rocky summit at 3900ft. An incredible 360 degree view! Mount Hood shining in the afternoon sun to the east. Gumboot Mountain across the canyon. By faith we know that Portland and Vancouver are in the haze to the southwest but their shimmering lights are clearly seen at night. From the summit we glass the edges of the forest down the three canyons that form the sides of the west peak. We call for whatever might come to the predator call. Nothing comes. We relax. We wish we'd brought the camera.

Back at the van our ambition is to follow the forest roads to northeast Clark County then south back to town. Managed to get my Ford 350 extended van over 5 landslides on Road 54 -- truly an amazing feat -- but when we arrived at "the wash out", it was the end of the line. From 60 yards away, on the other side of the chasm, the road worker called that if we only came a week and a half later, we'd be able to get across...

We backtracked and were home by 8. In yesterday's excursion, my son loaded and unloaded his sidearm 3 times and I loaded and unloaded my rifle twice.

Now if you call ma a "toad" ever again, I make you read somethng twice as long.

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from coulterboy wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

To each his own. It doesn't really matter what you have. Just because you don't have a rifle that doesn't have a detachable magazine, or perhaps you do, makes you think it's not worth it. Learn to familiarize with your equipment. I personally don't have a rifle with a detachable mag. All of them are hinged floorplates -SAKO, Winchester and Savage. But I will not badmouth the detachable magazine option. People complaining about the magazine accidentally dropping makes me really think they don't really pay close attention to their rifles nuances. I have been hunting in almost all scenarios - desert, thick brush, in the thickets, rain, snow or sunshine, and I don't see it in my lifetime to accidentally pop my hinged floorplate, or if I have a detachable mag, drop one. C'mon guys, sometimes it's just jealousy. I would comment more on rifle accuracy, than a petty option of a detachable mag.

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from coulterboy wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

To each his own. It doesn't really matter what you have. Just because you don't have a rifle that doesn't have a detachable magazine, or perhaps you do, makes you think it's not worth it. Learn to familiarize with your equipment. I personally don't have a rifle with a detachable mag. All of them are hinged floorplates -SAKO, Winchester and Savage. But I will not badmouth the detachable magazine option. People complaining about the magazine accidentally dropping makes me really think they don't really pay close attention to their rifles nuances. I have been hunting in almost all scenarios - desert, thick brush, in the thickets, rain, snow or sunshine, and I don't see it in my lifetime to accidentally pop my hinged floorplate, or if I have a detachable mag, drop one. C'mon guys, sometimes it's just jealousy. I would comment more on rifle accuracy, than a petty option of a detachable mag.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Carney

I was out LD weekend over in the 336 and 340 units south of Cle Elum checking on my son and a friend archery hunting. Man it's dry up there on Manastash and S. Cle Elum Ridges. Thought I might pop a grouse or two with the old Savage 24 .22-.410 gun, but no chickens to be seen. Went over to Tamarack Springs and up on Quartz Mtn until I got tired. Lots of old sign, none new. No 'yotes either. Haven't hunted up there in 5 years. I'm sure it is still a circus during rifle season.

Cheers

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

WMHunter,
We ran into a few archery hunters. One said he saw a 5X bull but wasn't close enough for a shot -- which is why I rifle hunt...

We had a lot of rain over the weekend -- didn't you get any of that up there?

And what about bear -- much of anything in the East Cascades units?

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from O Garcia wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

clay cooper, but if you use that M1A with scope, stripper clips out of the question.

Z41, Nelsol, coulterboy, nice summations.

when you really think about it, for every person that dislikes a detachable mag, there's another person that absolutely hates blind magazines (OK, there's Ross Seyfried, for one, sorry Ross). the point is not to incite a flaming war, or to drop more gunwriter names, but simply to emphasize that every design has faults, and if one wants to find fault, something will be found. it's how it's built that makes a design work. with the exception of the "Chauchat" perhaps, that dang weapon has no hope of salvation in this earth.

and one still needs to use a weapon, device or tool well in order to make it work properly. no matter how well it's made. or designed.

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from elmer f. wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

in a high power, bolt action, big game rifle, i agree 100%. but in a semi-auto, that i may want to use for smaller objects like coyote, or similar sized objects, i like detachable mags. why? because primarily of the laws in my state. here, we can not use a firearm that holds more than 5 rounds (including one in the chamber) semi-auto rifles (other than a 22 rimfire) for anything on public property. now, even though the chances of me NEEDING more than 5 rounds in rapid sucession are slim, if i do, i dont want to have to take all the time to dig out the rounds, and shove them into the gun and all the while, my next prospective target is running away. with a detachable mag, i simply drop the empty and slide in a new one. besides, haveing 5 loose cartridges in your coat or pants make a lot of noise, unless you put each one in a different pocket. where as a d.m. holds them all nice and tight in place keeping them quiet. besides, with a medium caliber semi-auto, the strength of the rifle is not really all that compromised. if we were talking 300 win mag or larger, that would be a different story.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

@ Carney

We had some rain, but not a deluge up in Skagit Co. I live between Conway and Lake Sixteen. The report that I got last night from my friend and son said that it rained like crazy over on the east slopes in the Manastash and Taneum areas. It was raining pretty hard on the I-90 corridor Sunday, but it was clear Tuesday on the flight from Seatac to Spokane and return.

They have not seen any bears at all. Old sign. Son has a bear tag so that is his gig. They came home yesterday, but are going back Saturday for the rest of the archery elk season. Me, I'm taking the big dog goose hunting.

I'll let you know if I hear any bear reports.

Cheers

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from lmfansler wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree completely. There is no need for something that is just going to make your rifle more cumbersome and awkward. There is no reason for that. If you are in the military or you are going somewhere were you would need to have that ability to load that many rounds then maybe. However, hunting with a detachable magazine makes no sense. I mean if a cartrige isn't in the right spot you could have jams. If it is dropped and even a grain of sand in it, then you are looking at possible damage to the rifle. Detachable magazines are not logical or feasible.

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Elmer = "now, even though the chances of me NEEDING more than 5 rounds in rapid sucession are slim, if i do, i dont want to have to take all the time to dig out the rounds, and shove them into the gun and all the while, my next prospective target is running away."

I would be much more concerned about needing more bullets for a target that is running toward you -- rather than away!!! ;-)

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from Jere Smith wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

If you can't GIT-R_DONE with the first 5 rounds, chances are even greater you won't with 5 more! EH? JMNSVHO. ( actually my Drill Sergeant IN 1959 said that in a little more salty language!

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from jherbine wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Bear hunting in PA, we put on drive after drive each day of the season. Alternating between driving and being on watch means loading and unloading quite a bit. And sometimes there is deep snow on the ground. Having a detachable magazine is much preferred as cartridges are otherwise easily dropped and lost in the snow with each unloading cycle.

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from albertahunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Very interesting reading the comments. Our opinions obviously have something to do with aging. My view on issues has changed drastically over a few decades. Firstly anything I hunt with now has to work flawlessly and I find myself buying better quality accessories. Secondly I have to have confidence with whatever I am using and know its limitations. Complaints about clips falling out are valid as I found a clip in my vehicle after the season from a friend who has a pump -06. This clip did not work in my gun as well as my two. Not sure why. If you are removing a clip, do it. dont activate the release and start doing something else. the clip can fall out at anytime. when inserting a clip make sure you hear the release clik to lock it in or again, clip can fall out later. practice at home because out in the field you dont need aggravations with gear. My Remington is a bit older then me, mfg more then half a century ago and in mint condition, having only shot half a box of ammo before I got it. I have never had a clip/feeding failure of any kind in the couple decades I have had it and some of our hunting seasons are in the minus 30's. It would take a lot of $$ for me to part with it as well because it still does its job as good as possible. I must conclude we use what works best for each of us.

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from Hunter Savage wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

to me it dont matter if it has got a hinged floor plate blind magazine or detachable mag or a single shot, i own at lest one of each type, if it is a gun its a good thing .

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

I've hunted with a Rem Auto for many years and no problems with the magazines. I carry one in the gun and a spare in my pocket loaded. I lways load the chamber from the mazagine so I know the magazine is feeding proper. I never drop one irectly into the chamber. 4 rounds is enough or you need pratice. Same goes now for my Bolt guns that do have floor plates and solids.All will hold 5 rounds, but again, 4 is enough.When days hunt is over using 4 rounds, I remove the one in the chamber and then re-insert into to chamber and not recycle daily as stated above. I do rotate now and then the shell I;m using to prevent damage to the point. I would be uins the 750 today out west if the guids would allow one in the chamber, but they will not and to chamber a Auto, the racket can be heard 5 miles away, as you must pull that lever all the way back and let it drop to ensure a round seats proper in the chamber.I can use any rifle as long as I'm hunting, even S/S. but prefer the old faithful 742 or the 700 CDL. Shoot-um-straight and often. PS; Keep that magazine and chamber clean on any gun.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Good points, Gunslinger.

Since I usually walk in and out of my hunting area in the dark with an empty chamber, I keep 4 in the magazine and chamber one when I am ready to shoot or sit for a spell. You are correct, the autoloaders make lots of noise but are easy to unload. Clean and maintained is the key.

Best regards,
WMH

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Solution?

Decaffeinated Coffee!

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

WAMtnhunter:After reading all the above articles, it came to me that 99% of our guns jamming problems occur due to a dirty firearm or the parts that move about. I'm a nut about clean guns,After each days hunt, I wipe/clean my guns well even if not fired. A Oily rag never shot out a gun to my knowledge, With my Auto;s with magazine,only problem I had many yrs ago was a fouled chamber. TAlked to gun smith and he informed me to buy a bronze brush, then a short handled mop and clean that chamber after a good soaking of Hopps. I did that and no problems since. I do my 700's the same. Plus to help keep trash out, I put a small piece of tape over the muzzle to keep out whatever may fall into it,especially rain or snow.I also when hunting out west, keep oil out of the mechanics of my gun and spray a tad of powder graphite on the bolt and tigger parts. In sub freezing weather rain, snow and prevent a trophy going home. Me, I not really fussy about type of gun, just give me a gun, and let hit the woods or whatever. After 60+ yrs of hunting, I can hunt with anygun, so long as I;ve shot it once before going hunting and make sure the zero is ok for me, My old eyes need a scope now, but with the Fiber Optric sights, does help on un scoped guns, especially early and late. For years I painted a red dot on my front sight and a small white V on the rear sight. Anyway, we all got our rathers, thats why so many different types made. I'm on the verge of buying a dble bbl 30-06 imported from Spain. Has a jack screw to line up the left bbl. comes with sights,but on top of action has about 8" of a grove on both sides to allow putting a Weaver type rings on. This gun at one time was imported from Russia by EAA. Now in short supply in the 45-70 (Way back ordered) I saw the gun this past week end, nothing fancy, but functional as you need for hunting. And the wt is about right for me. Lastly, it don;t cost 2 arms and both legs, less than $l500.00 POA. I don;t need it, but just want it. At 74, how many more guns will I shoot???? OK, Shoot-um-straight and very often.PS; Gun is now available in 3 Calibers. 30-06,270 and 45-70. Hey WAHunter, what is your # 1 game Animal up your way?. Also, Love my MArlin XL7 in 270. A perfect gun for rough treatment like a 4 wheeler or hauling around in my farm truck looking for Yotes. Zeroed at 200 yds, will put 3 rounds within 2-3" till bbl gets hot.Then I change gund and shoot them a while. Know a guy who puts his just fired bbls in a 5 gallon bucket of water???????? to cool off. I'd be afraid of that, but $$$ no problem to him.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Many clip magazines are a piece of junk, many even plastic (ask Rem about them ), but the drop out magazines for my Rem's work great. I do not oil the clip, only wipe with a damp rag, as the graphite makes work smother. But will agree somewhat that a solid stock gun is stronger and fits one's hand a ad better. I was un-aware that you could drop a round directly in the chamber of a Mauser action which has the CLAW? Am I wrong? And if so, by dropping directly into the chamber, will the claw catch the belt on the shell to eject? This MArlin XL7 has a Mauser type ejector, not as wide as the Custom MAuser I have but still a claw type. O was by Wally World today to view anything I must have, their shelves had less amo than my tool box has in it. Not a Box of the popular calibers and did have a few boxes of regulr Winchester's in 06 @27.95 per box. Few rounds of 22's and cheapo shotgun shells. Ammo is had to find, I can;t find any of the Rem, Scirocco's, should have a plenty, but like to stock-pile a few extra Boxes,in case I won a Far off HUNT.May need to geta buddy to load a few rounds for me for pratice, but when hunt time comes I want the real thing of top quality available, not the WW specials. I mention on one of the Topics that the dble bbl 06 Iwant, made in Spain had a Oak stock, a mistake, it is oil smooth Walnut of top quality, a tad large grip, but may require such on such a gun???? Now to find a dealer who has one that I want and price I can live with.I think Rem screwed up when they bought them out from EAA and then charged moe than dble for a few they made. Now rem has dropped them and I can get one from Spain as the supply comes available.

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Of all the thousands of rounds out of a M1A and M1 Garand, I never had a problem. Keep your equipment clean and in good operating condition and it will give you flawless performance!

What’s better, Hummer or a M-38 Jeep ?

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from crm3006 wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Clay Cooper-
A M-38 Jeep, of course. No computer, can be lifted out of a hole by one GI, can be repaired by any idiot with a pair of pliers and a little baling wire, won't stick in mud, sand, snow or rivers, will start after rain storms, sand storms, in cold or heat, and will never let you down if you add water, oil and mogas as needed.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

@ Gunslinger

To answer your question about what is the #1 game animal locally:

Blacktail deer and black bears are pretty popular locally. East of the Cascades, it is mule deer and elk. Lots of whitetails in the Northeast, too.

If it is any indication, there were 166,000 deer tags and 105,000 elk tags sold last year. I bet most of the elk tag purchasers also bought one of the deer tags.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

WA MTNHUNTER: Sounds as if you live in game heaven. We got w-tails rnning out our ears, but not quality animals. No onew will kill the Does so inbreed and now teh Bucks horns look like toothpicks.I wish I lived cle enough to Elk and Mulies to fill my tag now and then, but I;m about 2500 miles away from MT and NW C0. With my health,I'm forced to stand hunt and not go wher the game may be. But to just be out there is enjoyable. No place as beautiful as the Rocky Mtns.I was in your neck of teh woods in July of 98 for 2 weeks, saw little game, but this was not a hunt, was US Tour that wife and i had planned for years. 3-4 months on the road away from home was great, and saw lots of teh country will never see again. Unless, I find a freebie or nearly freebie hunt westward, I'm afraid my Rocky mtns hunt are history. My health has gone South this pst year and I cancelled outmy MT trip this fall. May try to find a hunt near NE Montana next year for Elk/Lopes/Mulies ifcan work a good deal with some ramcher or whom-ever. Be nice to find a club that caters to the disabled/handicapped, but they also strapped for funds as well. Have been advised to contactthe Chamber of Commerce in some of the small towns and see if they have any clubs/Ranches that would be in a range I could afford to go to. I would like at lest one more trip West while yet able to go. Health rally is going fast, but at 74 suppose to I guess. I yet am able to shoot as well as evere, just not able to walk far at all. So will hunt here for w-tails this fall and pray i can arrange a hunt Westward for next year.Hpefully the economy will improve and my retirement funds will come bac to afford a hunt. Shoot-um-sraight and often.My Son of 55 ys old, wants to go Elk hunting, hopefully I can work out something that will allow he and I to fullfill his dream and mine next season. Where you hunt B-tails, is that in the dark,damp rainforrest? How about the Bears?

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from Carney wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

WAMNTHUNTER = since when is it legal to have 4 cartridges in your rifle while hunting in WA State ?!?!?! That's like a $400 ticket, man.

Gunslinger, This is not game heaven -- it is hunter hell. Maybe it's not so bad on the east side but hunting in the Cascades for black tail is like chasing a ghost on 50 degree slopes, through tangles of vine maple in the rain. But I do love this! I do wish we had a more target rich environment as I hate investing lots of time and effort in "the hunt" with nothing but a good, challenging time to show for it. My new motto = REAL MEN HUNT BLACK TAIL!

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

@Carney

Not so, sir. The only restriction in the WA hunting regs and RCW for 3 shells is for waterfowl hunting with a shotgun.

Gunslinger

There are lots of different species but also a lot of hunters and lots of restricted land. Bears are pretty common in the NE corner of the state and west slopes of the Cascades. Tough hunting in that thick timber with lots of alder and maple during the spring and early fall.

I have a long standing treaty with Mr. Bear. He doesn't bother me and I leave him and his kin alone. My son hunts them, but I don't. I will hunt the late November blacktail season in the hills behind the house if it is cold enough and most of the leaves are gone. Otherwise, I'm quack whackin' or snow goose hunting with the dog. Usually by the time I get back from Colorado, the ducks and snow geese are in full swing! The dog is too much of a pain if I do much other than waterfowl hunt once the birds are flying.

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from Carney wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Hmm. I'll have check that out... I've not looked in print but have had a forest ranger as well as all the hunter's ed facilitators that my kids have had, lay down the 3 cartridge rule -- for big game hunting as well as waterfowl.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Carney,

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I even looked it up again.

Some of the USFS guys (not all) are a bunch of anti's and old liberal hippies and disinformation is the name of their game. Hunter Ed guys I've sat in were all good intentioned but not necessarily well armed with facts when teaching out of the NRA or national pubs put out by other agencies. Out to be a test on State Regs before you get a card IMHO.

Cheers

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Should have read; "Hunter Ed guy's classes I've sat in on were all good intentioned but not necessarily well armed with facts when teaching out of the NRA or national pubs put out by other agencies. Ought to be a test on State Regs before you get a hunter safety card IMHO."

Sorry

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from Carney wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Wa Mnt Hntr = I stand corrected. Couldn't find it anywhere so I dropped by WDFW on my way past it today and they agreed with you -- carry as many bullets in your rifle as you can fit!

So, old wive's tales die hard... I bet I could pose the question to anybody at the range or the gun stores and I'd get the "3 cartridge rule".

I also agree that the hunter's ed program could stand a lot of upgrade. I've taken 3 kids through what is reputed to be "the best" in our area but it is less than sufficient.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

@ CARNEY

I have submitted my volunteer background check paperwork to the state to be able to work with youth in the Hunter Ed program. I think it is the same background checks like for school teachers, etc. So maybe I will have it back for next spring/summer classes. Time to give something back for a while and maybe improve the local courses which aren't bad, just could be a little better.

You are absolutely correct, those old wives tales live on forever. I asked a buddy of mine recently when was the last time he read the hunting regs cover to cover. He said about 4 years ago and said nothing ever changes. I told him that he was lucky he had not had a close encounter of the worst kind with a WDFW Enforcement Officer.

I hunt 3 states, so I am constantly reading the entire rule book of each to keep the stuff straight. Sometimes you need to be a Philadelphia lawyer to figure those things out!

Good hunting! Four weeks from today, I'll be unloading my gear at the ranch in Colorado! Neck swelling already! Time for the weekly shooting drills to commence. MOP at 400 yards is the goal.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

BTW, I'm hunting Alabama whitetails in December. As luck would have it, I'll be using one of my brother's rifles...a Remington 760 pump .270 Winchester with the dreaded detachable magazine. Beats shipping a rifle cross country. It does have a decent Bushnell Elite 3200 scope on it. It will be the first hunt ever wit ha .270 Winchester! If I like it , maybe I can talk him out of it. He He

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from Zermoid wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Gunslinger,

I've always been told that a Mauser Claw extractor can be broken by closing it on a round, they have to be fed from the mag or risk breakage. Don't know if new guns based on Mauser are any different or not. Mine is an old Swedish 98 stamped that it was made in 1941, if I remember right.

Anyone Know for sure if this is correct? Dave?

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

I have often wondered why many Custom rifles were made on Mauser actions due to that fact. I;m no expert by any means,but don;t see how the claw can catch the belt of the bullet to retrive.I do own a Custon Nauser, made in Germany/Italy and you cannot drop one in the chamber and close the bolt.I never used a lot of pressure to force the bolt down, as have seen many claws ruined by doing so. However, regardless if can or can;t, i prefer to feed from the magazine, then I kmow the 4 bulles are stacked correct and the other 3 will feed proper. A must on a clip or hingd magazine or plain stock , is to insert the bullet heel first into the chamber holding, not the tip.But in haste, have scewed up and reversed the filling and then you got a jam on your hands and watch the game flee. I got a old Rem Sportsman 48 12 ga HAD FOR 59 YRS AND IT WOULD NOT HOLD BUT 3 SHELLS. i USED IT FOR DEER ONLY so had the 2 indentions on opposite sides bored out so would hold 5 rounds.When bird hunting I use a Pencil to drop back to 3 rounds.Its a old gun but yet shoot perfect, never jammed period. Looks as if new othe than wood has darken.Blueing is 90%. Gun has killed many deer withBuck Shot over the years down East,as we had no deer here in the Mtns, but man have we got them now.Bow season is open, then Rifle begins No. 8th and runs thru Jan.2nd, 2010. Should get my fill of hunting in nearly 2 months. I am unable to pull a Bow,so I miss the Bow Season which is now open. Shoot-um-straight and often.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 29 weeks ago

I wish I could bow hunt, but not abe to drw back the thing, so just wait till gun season .wITH A EXTA WEEK of b/pwder AND 2 WEEKS OF RIFLE,SHOULD get in enough hunting I suppose. But so far have not. LAst year I hunted over 52 days. If was able to walk and bird hunt would be even more days afield.Suppose in our old age, we suppose to get out our fishing tackle and forget hunting?????WRONG, will hunt as long as can get out in the woods. Saw a Cartoon with a guy lying in a Hosp bed on the back of a pickup, nurse beside him ,gun in his lap, all kinda tubes run to him and it says, this may be my last hunt.Two yrs ago had this hunt lined up in MT but got dble Pnemunia in both lungs and was in hospital for 3 weeks. This was only 2 weeks prior to my trip. MAn was I weak. But Dr. Gave nme enough RX's and a letter for a Dr in Mt if I needed one. So I went and killed a nice Mulie. Something about hunting will get us well fast I we had 12 months of hunting, I would be out most days or part of. In N.C. they do not allow hunting. Suppose we hunters need a day off, I know I do. Ok, guys, shoot um and often.

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from FloridaHunter1226 wrote 4 years 17 weeks ago

Never really had anything against them but have never bought a rifle with a detachable magazine because I have liked the other. I now have something against detachable magazines. But another point to add.... who do you think you have to buy another magazine from after you loose 'em.... maybe the manufacturers and gun companies have found a way to make a lot more money than usual than with fixed magazines.

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from Mauser M03 wrote 3 years 27 weeks ago

In my Mauser M03 I can choose if I want to lock the magazine securely in place and feed/empty from the top or if I want to use it as a conventional detachable mag. If you ask me there are pros and cons for both solutions, so why not have both? For accuracy, it groups at about 1/2" @ 100yards, plenty good enough for most hunting.

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from Nicholas Rice wrote 1 year 32 weeks ago

Okay has anyone considered that in order to keep gun rights for all of us you have to eliminate (as much as possible) ID10T mistakes. Considering the good rifles that get bad raps such as when a dumb but has his/her hand over muzzle of gun with a loaded round, Has it ever occured that detachable mags in weird way prevent that? You made the statement and I quote: "I’ve heard it said that detachable magazines “…make it easier to load and unload your rifle.” True, but how hard is it to cycle three cartridges through the action or drop a floorplate?" Well my rifle doesn't have a floor plate or a detachable mag. It does have a three position and yes I do cycle the rounds out. However the man who sold me the gun bought it originally for the half-safe position on the safety becuase one of his buddies had be unloading a bolt in his truck and it was one of these rifles where you have to have the safety on fire to work the bolt.... You can see where this going can't you. As he moved the bolt forward the gun went off and put a nice .270 cal hole in the floorboard of his truck. Now most of us are smart enough not to wait until a we are in a moving vehicle to unload a rifle this is true. But we all know not to trust any mechanical device such as safety 100% or we should. Cycling the shells out on some weapons especially bolts, levers and pumps.(most automatics have a removable mag meaning the only shell to extract is the one in the chamber when your done. A fact that careful thinking about things has made me more appreciative of things.) in creases the chance of the shell going off all while making my gun safe. No it's not hard to cycle the rounds and I always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction but a detachable not only makes it faster but I'm not exposing more than one shell at time to that firing pin. Math is simple no mag no bullets in the gun. At this point I'll make it feed right I wish almost all firearms had detachable mags. As with all problems this is not fool proof but I think I've made my point if it helps I want it.

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from Nicholas Rice wrote 1 year 32 weeks ago

Okay has anyone considered that in order to keep gun rights for all of us you have to eliminate (as much as possible) ID10T mistakes. Considering the good rifles that get bad raps such as when a dumb but has his/her hand over muzzle of gun with a loaded round, Has it ever ocured that detachable mags in weird way prevent that? You made the statement and I quote: "I’ve heard it said that detachable magazines “…make it easier to load and unload your rifle.” True, but how hard is it to cycle three cartridges through the action or drop a floorplate?" Well my rifle doesn't have a floor plate or a detachable mag. It does have a three position and yes I do cycle the rounds out. However the man who sold me the gun bought it originally for the half-safe position on the safety becuase one of his buddies had be unloading a bolt in his truck and it was one of these rifles where you have to have the safety on fire to work the bolt.... You can see where this going can't you. As he moved the bolt forward the gun went off and put a nice .270 cal hole in the floorboard of his truck. Now most of us are smart enough not to wait until a we are in a moving vehicle to unload a rifle this is true. But we all know not to trust any mechanical device such as safety 100% or we should. Cycling the shells out on some weapons especially bolts, levers and pumps.(most automatics have a removable mag meaning the only shell to extract is the one in the chamber when your done. A fact that careful thinking about things has made me more appreciative of things.) in creases the chance of the shell going off all while making my gun safe. No it's not hard to cycle the rounds and I always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction but a detachable not only makes it faster but I'm not exposing more than one shell at time to that firing pin. Math is simple no mag no bullets in the gun. At this point I'll make it feed right I wish almost all firearms had detachable mags. As with all problems this is not fool proof but I think I've made my point if it helps I want it.

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from MReeder wrote 1 year 32 weeks ago

Double Amen to DEP.
With the exception of an old Lee Enfield No. 4 MK I picked up recently to play with, the only detachable magazine rifle I have ever owned is an old J.C. Higgins Model 103.228 .22 bolt action that I inherited from my dad. I've never had much opportunity to go squirrel or rabbit hunting with it, since most of my small game hunting has been on public land where rifles are not legal. Best guess would be that I've taken it hunting maybe a dozen times, and yet I've had to replace the damned magazine three times. The release is just about where I cradle it with my hand and somewhere along the line I would release it and never know it was missing until I got back to my truck.
Everything else I own is either a blind box or a hinged floorplate and I've never had any trouble with any of them. If you can't hit some poor creature with the three to five cartridges already available it's not too likely it's going to stand around and pose for you while you fish out another detachable magazine. Just something else to go wrong.

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from J.B.H wrote 1 year 31 weeks ago

exactely. with firearms, it helps to keep things simple and it seems that the simpler things are, the more reliable. I really do wish that they stop doing that. Good post Mr. Petzal

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Bottom line

If you have quality equipment and maintain it properly, they function flawlessly!

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from MLH wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Loading and unloading a blind magazine in the cold and dark is a pain in the butt. Can easily drop cartridges. When unloaded, need to put them somewhere, preferably in a pretty leather bullet carrier that has to be dug out of a pocket or pack or carried on a belt or stock. On blind or hinged floorplate guns fixed blade ejectors are nice.

Box mags are handy to remove and put into a pack or coat pocket - nice and orderly and protect bullet tips. I've have guns with box mags that are as hunting accurate as guns with blind mags or hinged floorplates, so the extra strength of a full stock doesn't carry any water with me. For deer hunting box mags are near perfect.

If I were to go after dangerous game where I had to minimize the chance of anything going wrong, then no mag (double) makes a whole lot of sense. So, why not just say to hell with mags altogether?

And mags work just fine in my pistols, though I prefer revolvers for hunting. And while we are on it, loading and unloading single action revolvers is a pain in the butt ....

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from Walt Smith wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I personaly like the detachable magazine on my remington 740, I like the fact that I don't have to mash my $50.00 a box ammo through my action,every day, knocking off the points and screwing up my expensive bullets accuracy. But I'm sure there is something nostalgic about running your ammo thru your action everynight when you didn't get a chance to shoot that might make the old timers feel better. Ha Ha.

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from Mark-1 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I have no use for a detach mag on a bolt action hunting rifle, either. The only rationale is a need to toss a bunch of lead down range. Few hunting situations are such.

As said one more item to feed Murphy's Law.

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from wingshooter54 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Remington stayed on my s**t list for many years because they took their fine Model 700 Mountain rifle and turned it into a detachable magazine piece of crap. It ruined the lines of the stock and the total looks of the gun. Why they ever stopped making this model of 700 is beyond me, but Remington has a track record of stupidly dropping guns from their line; Remington 32 (Kreighoff made a killing out of that one!!) Model 3200 - one of the best competition shotguns ever, anywhere, Nylon 66, etc. If you can find an original 700 mountain rifle in 280, 7x57, or 257 Roberts you will pay a premium, but have a great rifle. My present one is a Model 700 mountain stainless/laminate in .260 Remington -- about as good as it gets.
Michael

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from O Garcia wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

the detachable mags on hunting rifles have the same capacity or in the case of the Blaser, even less than that of the hinged floorplate fixed magazine types. So I don't understand the suppressing fire comment from Mike Diehl, except perhaps if he meant the fast reloads detachables allow, assuming you have spare magazines. Otherwise, if you only have one magazine, there's really no firepower advantage to the detachable.

I think John Barsness wrote when reviewing the Browning A-Bolt that his wife prefers the A-Bolt because with her weaker fingers (apologies to the huntresses reading), she finds she could load cartridges on the Browning detachable better than on a fixed magazine rifle. So there's some merit to some detachables, at least to the Browning. And it also attaches with reasonable security to a floorplate, so it's not so easy to lose.

The merits of a detachable magazine on military rifles is obvious. Even on bolt action sniper rifles, detachables are gaining ground. If you have a round in the chamber but would like to top up, you could keep the bolt in battery, ready to fire on the enemy, while inserting a fresh, full mag (or, again, if you only carry one mag, topping it up with fresh rounds). The detachable also makes it easier to load a scoped bolt rifle, and when you see the scope bases/mounts being used by Marines on those modified Remington 700s, you know they crowd into the loading/ejection port making it really tight. Obviously, if you're a sniper worth your badge, you won't need to reload fast, but even the best snipers can be surprised, and then they have to fire really fast and reload. Yeah, this is also the reason why the semi-auto sniper rifle is once again being considered.

Probably the best military bolt action rifle of all time, when you throw out all the romanticism attached to the Mauser, is the British Lee-Enfield. It featured a detachable magazine that was used by the British NOT as a detachable, but as a fixed. They loaded it from the top with stripper clips. Adds nothing to the discussion, but I thought I'd throw it in.

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Occasionally I hunt with a M1A with absolutely no magazine problem with the exception to additional bulk and weight. I fully agree magazines can be something else to look after and possibly lose. I remember a Fella sitting on his stand with a Remington auto and when he raised and fired the Mag was in his lap! It’s really hard to miss and lose a M1A Mag compared to a Remington 4 rounder!

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from Devil_Dog wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I for one like detachable magazines. No wear on the rounds, quick and simple to load/ unload the rifle, and more importantly to me, easier to clean the rifle's belly. Hinged floorplates aren't bad for this, but I don't want to have to pull a stock off a blind magazine everytime I hunt in wet weather to make sure my rifle's guts stay clean. And yes it takes a little extra work to clean a magazine, but it's still alot easier than pulling a stock off. And as for accuracy, I want minute of deer out to 300 yards. My Rem7600 does this just fine.

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from crm3006 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I will add my Amen to DEP's detestation of detachable magazines. I have exactly one rifle with such an abomination, and it is a Kimber .22 LR. Not a dangerous game gun, unless you encounter a charging rabbit. The squirt gun (M1A), of course, has a detachable
magazine, but that was developed by John C. Garand for military use, and I have never seen one properly locked in that failed. As to cycling rounds through the action, what is wrong with simply pressing down the rounds and closing the bolt on an empty chamber? I carry a rifle like this a lot on the lease, and when it is time to load, you simply bolt the action. Saves noise and wear and tear on bullet noses. I realize that this won't work in all situations due to "loaded firearms" laws in some jurisdictions, but it should work on a hunting lease. If the chamber is empty and the firing pin is down it is unloaded, right? As to hinged floor plates, they are convenient, but tend to fail at inconvenient times. I have had one dump cartridges on the ground for me, and tend to inspect them carefully and have had one sealed. I like the blind magazines, except on the M1A.

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I never owned a rifle with anything but a tubular magazine until this past spring. I purchased a BLR in 300WinMag. (Finally got it!) The detachable box mag was defective -- wouldn't cycle the first round -- and had to be sent back to the factory... (I'd have just sent me a new one...)

Never the less, I was out in the woods today and in Washington State it is illegal to have a loaded rifle in the car. So I must admit it was pretty darn convenient to not have to cycle anything -- just pop! and the mag and bullets went on the dash! Seems pretty alright to me! -- so far...

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

WAMountainHunter,

Nope -- not a road hunter during deer or elk season but scouting ahead of the season is a different story.

SO, let me tell you about my time in the woods yesterday. Finished a construction project by 1PM and took the rest of the day off. Headed out Road 42 in the Gifford Pinchot National Forest with my 15 year old son. The road climbs from 800ft to 3200ft where road 53 splits off and rides the ridges of mountains sloped with some of the most dense evergreen forest and impenetrable undergrowth.

Right now, bear is the only big game in season, but coyote, bobcat, forest grouse, rabbit -- and other things that I haven't ever seen in our woods are legal...

As Road 53 pushes past Saturday Rock and climbs to 3500 ft, one can be surprised at the amount of coyote scat dropped on the road. When it's fresh and there's a decent place to pull off, we step out push up or down the mountain to set up and call for coyote! (The first time they came to the call I had my Marlin 1895 with that stupid cross bolt safety. Pulled the hammer out of half cock, pressed the trigger and heard that mind scrambling "plank!". By the time the safety was off we were busted and I couldn't find them in the scope again fast enough...)

If there's no action, we head back to the van unload and move along. At the least, we've observed more of what's going on in the woods in that particular canyon or ridge.

Yesterday we parked at the base of the western peak of the Tatoosh Hills. Climbed through the rough woods looking for fresh sign of anything. Feasted on huckleberries and pushed past the forest toward the rocky summit at 3900ft. An incredible 360 degree view! Mount Hood shining in the afternoon sun to the east. Gumboot Mountain across the canyon. By faith we know that Portland and Vancouver are in the haze to the southwest but their shimmering lights are clearly seen at night. From the summit we glass the edges of the forest down the three canyons that form the sides of the west peak. We call for whatever might come to the predator call. Nothing comes. We relax. We wish we'd brought the camera.

Back at the van our ambition is to follow the forest roads to northeast Clark County then south back to town. Managed to get my Ford 350 extended van over 5 landslides on Road 54 -- truly an amazing feat -- but when we arrived at "the wash out", it was the end of the line. From 60 yards away, on the other side of the chasm, the road worker called that if we only came a week and a half later, we'd be able to get across...

We backtracked and were home by 8. In yesterday's excursion, my son loaded and unloaded his sidearm 3 times and I loaded and unloaded my rifle twice.

Now if you call ma a "toad" ever again, I make you read somethng twice as long.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I loaded many a detachable/box magazine in the cold, dark, rain, and snow in my 7 years, 9 months, and 21 days in this man's Army and blind/florplate ones all the years hunting since. Loading a blind magazine or a detachable magazine can be a challenge for the fumble fingered, scared, nervous, or climate challenged. Either is another "chance to excel" as we used to say. Training and practice can overcome!

For the average hunter: KISS

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from JCB wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

The detachable has a place in the vehicle. The road hunters need a detachable magazine so they can unload the gun fast, before the game warden pulls them over.

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from AlaskanExile wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree with Dr. Petzal on this one. Detachable magazines are nothing but trouble on a hunting rifle.I have a buddy who has hunted since his teen years (he's early 40's) with a Remington 760 pump, but sold it last fall without a magazine, after it dropped out the "last" magazine on a mule deer hunt. He had lost close to 10 over the course of his life, and had hit the end of the road.
I have a Remington 788 that uses unavailable magazines (no one makes them, especially not Remington) I've turned down offers of $60 ea for my spares because they are irreplaceable. I was lucky enough to find those at a gun show. They can, and do fall out in the field and are slow to change. A blind magazine would be better.
I have a Browning A-Bolt 7Mag, that has probably the best detachable magazine ever, I agree with Barsness and O'Garcia on that. Best detachable mag hunting rifle; that's kind of like being the skinniest kid at fat-camp. The A-Bolt uses a box magazine that you must attach to the floorplate while it's open, then close it with the box attached. It's not the quickest reload, but you can load it through the port like a blind magazine, and you can drop a round on top of the follower and just slam it home too.
It is a hard piece of gear to lose(drop), but still possible to forget it at home. I have gotten to the range without it before, and that is really a drag when that rifle was the reason I was going shooting. If I got to a faraway hunting camp without it I would be in a rough spot. Replacements only come from Browning and retail for nearly $60 with shipping.
I never forget the magazine for my Savage. Idiot proof; best for me.
Just my two-cents
AKX

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from AlaskanExile wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

OlSingleshot;
I didn't say I couldn't adapt, I hunt with rifles that use them. I said detachable magazines were trouble. Extra trouble that I don't need when I'm trying to enjoy myself and go shooting or go hunting.
The Remington pump and autoloader magazines have a nasty habit of hanging in there after the release catch has been pressed, then they fall out later, down the trail. If you don't see, hear or feel it drop into the snow, it's gone. My friend sold his rifle because he was tired of losing magazines.
I own several semiauto pistols and have special pouches to keep the magazines in. I have lost magazines in the field for my autoloading pistol. Those magazines are available for less than $30, not expensive or difficult to replace, my 788 Remington is another story.
Blind Magazine=less to go wrong.
If you like detachable magazines, that's great, I wish my 788 had a blind magazine, that's all.
AKX

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from jbird wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

My Dad hunted w/ a Savage 30-06 for 40 years, problems he had with the detachable mag---- 0.

I've hunted w/ a pre-64 Mod 70 .270 for 19 years, problems I've had w/ the hinged floorplate---- 0!

My Grandpa hunted with the same Mod. 70 for 40 years before giving it to me, problems he had w/ the hinged floorplate----- 0!

That's 99 years of hunting w/ detachable mags/hinged floorplates with NO malfunctions, I guess I just don't get what the problem is?????

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from nelsol wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Detachable magazines---I love them. Browning A-bolt, never a problem with the detachable box magazine. Carry a spare in my pocket. Never had the need to reload in the field. If you can't get by with 4 rounds, you probably need more practice.
Ever lose a 1911, Glock, Sig, S&W mag for autoloaders? No, you keep them where they belong, either in the weapon or in a mag case on your belt where they are easily accessable. Same can be said for the speed loaders for revolvers. Keep up with your stuff--just like your truck keys, your wallet, or your woman.
It's never the gun, it's the nut behind the butt.

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from vtbluegrass wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

What the hell is wrong with the actions on your rifles thats its tearing up bullet noses? Seriously people

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from Jim in Mo wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

If I had the knowledge of a young computer geek I would link this site to the East Central Missouri Black Baptist Choir and we could all join in a beautiful rendition of "Aahmen, Aahmen, Aaahahmen Aahmen Aahmen".
Sing It Louder Brother!

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from Bernie wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree with Dave on detachable magazines on a big game rifle--they are abominations and do nothing to add to the attractiveness of the rifle. All my center-fire rifles have hinged floorplates, and while I have heard stories about them giving way and dropping one's cartridges into the dirt or snow, it mercifully has never happened to me. That is after using rifles made by Sako, Winchester, Remington, Ruger and Weatherby. Maybe I have just been lucky.

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from general dethcoff wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree with your beef that a detachable magazine makes the stock less rigid and that the detachable magazine is easier to lose. However, on a blind magazine when you have to remove the same cartridges over and over again as I often do, the the tips of my bullets get all mashed up making me worry about their accuracy. I shoot .300 WSM winchester 180 grain CXP 3's out of my savage model 112. any advice?

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from general dethcoff wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

An AR style rifle in .260 or .308 is an excellent deer hunting rifle with a detachable magazine.

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from steve182 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

If you need to reload that fast while hunting, you should spend some more time on the range. Neither of my deer rifles feature detatchable magazines or hinged floor-plates.

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from MidMichHunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

After 30+ post, I'd think more people would have mentioned the cost associated with the damn box mags. AlaskanExile did, and I agree with him. I have a Browning A-Bolt as well, and the thought of dropping $60 to get a spare box mag kills me, because I also need a spare for my Browning BLR as well. So $120 extra just to cover my butt in case I loose one, that's hard to take. I wish I knew this before I bought the A-Bolt, which was my first rifle and my BLR which was my second. I guess ignorance is truly bliss..

Oh, BTW, why do the mags cost so much, there doesn't seem to be too much to them.

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from Jere Smith wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

The only time I used Detachable magazines was in the Army, after they did away with the best combat weapon ever! Changing the M-1 Garand to the M-14 then compounding the error with a POS called and AR 15/M16. Hated both of them, then they changed out the Best Pistol ever the 1911A1 for Barf!, a 9 MM Berreta 92 so the troops instead of actually having to aim and fire could use the "Spray & Pray" method of marksmanship! Happily Spec Ops people have more sense than that. And .45's are back in the system and the Barrett is in play. As well as some other more useful weapons. I never lost a magazine even in VIet Nam or other places I happened to be. But don't really care for them. JMNSVHO!

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from seadog wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Once again, I find myself in the middle. I don't think a detachable mag is an advantage on a hunting rifle for any type of legal hunting that most of us do. But some AR style weapons make good hunting rifles and some hunters like using them. I don't use them, but I don't want to see my right or anyone else's right to use them taken away. (I realize that Dave's point is only that we shouldn't--not that we shouldn't have the right.)

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from butterbean wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

IT all boils down to one thing. If it is a machanical device it must be cleaned and inspected on a regular basis. Magazines are used in some of the worst enviroments in the world and work very well. The same is said for bolt action and blind magazine guns. I happen to like both. If you let any of them get dirty and full of junk they will eventually fail

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from evadbuck wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I like both options. I have a very reliable Remington 742 Woodsman with detatchable in .308 and a fantastic Winchester model 70 classic sporter LT in .264 Win Mag with a hinged floor plate and I am ever so careful when unloading, sure takes time and care, but these were my Grandfathers work horses for years in the field and neither ever let him down.

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

crm3006

M1A with a 5 round mag and 5 round stripper clip works fantastic, you can reload faster than anyone in the field where mag capacity is limited to 5!

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

WMHunter,
We ran into a few archery hunters. One said he saw a 5X bull but wasn't close enough for a shot -- which is why I rifle hunt...

We had a lot of rain over the weekend -- didn't you get any of that up there?

And what about bear -- much of anything in the East Cascades units?

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Amen. Aside from autoloaders, they are as useful as teats on a bull, which (said autoloader) are next to the teats for a hunting rifle. JMHO

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Carney

I was out LD weekend over in the 336 and 340 units south of Cle Elum checking on my son and a friend archery hunting. Man it's dry up there on Manastash and S. Cle Elum Ridges. Thought I might pop a grouse or two with the old Savage 24 .22-.410 gun, but no chickens to be seen. Went over to Tamarack Springs and up on Quartz Mtn until I got tired. Lots of old sign, none new. No 'yotes either. Haven't hunted up there in 5 years. I'm sure it is still a circus during rifle season.

Cheers

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

@ Carney

We had some rain, but not a deluge up in Skagit Co. I live between Conway and Lake Sixteen. The report that I got last night from my friend and son said that it rained like crazy over on the east slopes in the Manastash and Taneum areas. It was raining pretty hard on the I-90 corridor Sunday, but it was clear Tuesday on the flight from Seatac to Spokane and return.

They have not seen any bears at all. Old sign. Son has a bear tag so that is his gig. They came home yesterday, but are going back Saturday for the rest of the archery elk season. Me, I'm taking the big dog goose hunting.

I'll let you know if I hear any bear reports.

Cheers

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from Mike Diehl wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

The presence or absence of a detachable mag is not a selling point for me. I can't see the urgent need for one in the hunting field. What're you gonna do? Suppressing fire on that deer?

I have a Ruger and I like the drop out floorplate. I have another rifle that has a rotary magazine -- you just press a button and all the bullets leap into your hand. I like that even more but understand that magazine design is rather expensive to manufacture.

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from ishawooa wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Obviously some types of rifles require a box magazine or "clip" such as the ARs and commercial semi-autos. Perhaps Browning offered the best design for the sportsman who wants to use such a rifle back in the late sixties when they marketed the BAR with a removable box magazine which attached to the dropping floor plate. Not the quickest for reloading but it does offer the majority of the advantages previously stated by you guys. Frankly I have bellowed loud and long in the past about my dislike for box magazines on bolt action rifles. If per chance you do lose the magazine 25 miles from pavement you have a rifle that is a single shot which is difficult to reload in a hurry. I don't like the blind magazine much except that it offers a superior external appearance and there is no freezing cold magazine floorplate to stick to your hand when you least want it. Regardless I mainly just stick to the good old fashioned built in magazine that swings open to drop my unused cartridges. If you are worried about it accidently opening and dropping your cartridges during the hunt a piece of duct tape will eliminate the problem. A gunsmith can also tighten the latching mechanism. Just to carry things a bit further I also admire single shot rifles like Dakotas and No. 1s. I have never owned either. As I see it the shooter of a single shot does have a magazine be it an extra cartridge in his forearm hand, in loops on his sling, perhaps in loops sewed to the shoulder of his jacket, in a pouch on his belt, or whatever so there is some possibility of getting that cartridge in the barrel for a quick followup that we all will need sooner or later for whatever reason. To each his own, that's why they make and sell all these designs in an effort to please at least some of us. Pick and use what you like...
Mike D: Those rotary magazines are fantastic, sure wish they were more readily available. I understand that indeed they are expensive to manufacture and somewhat difficult to clean. However Ruger seems to overcome both problems with the as-issued 10/22 rotary version which has been around for about fifty years. As I remember you are one of the blessed individuals who has a Mann-Sch which I assume has the rotary in no doubt a classic caliber. What an enjoyable rifle that must be.

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from sarg wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree 100%, I don't like Detachable mags on hunting rifles . I don't realy care much about Floorplates either. I don't like anything under a rifle stock. Someone said their bullets get boogered up when unloading with a rifle without a mag or floor plate, I have never had anthing like that to happen, but I've always hunted with a Rem. ADL, what do people do, stand in the middle of the road and eject their bullet in the road? Why add more probles to something when it's not necessary?

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from albertahunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I love my Remington 30-06 semiauto with its clips. I have far more expensive and larger guns but its this one that now gets used the most. I can have a clip of premium bullets and two of cheapos for coyotes/wolves. I dont lose bullets in the snow dumping a floorplate as here u cannot have ammo in a gun in vehicle. And the semi auto has anchored many of our large WT with that quick second shot without losing line of sight and I have the racks to prove it. Just my opinion of course.

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from Zermoid wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I got to say I prefer detachable mags, carrying extra mags beats carrying extra loose ammo and then having to stuff said ammo into the gun wearing bulky gloves. (gets near zero here in deer season, you don't go gloveless)
Popping out an empty mag and replacing it with a full one is easier, and the mag is harder to lose if you drop it then the loose ammo. (scatter a few rounds in a foot or so of snow and have fun trying to find them) I personally have had trouble with mags dropping on their own only once, a Universal M1 Carbine that did not like military surplus 30 rounders. Worked fine with commercial mfg ones though, go figure.

My Swedish Mauser has the original box mag, altho I did alter the follower to allow closing the bolt with an empty mag. The one thing that always bothers me is the fact that as soon as I close the bolt the rifle is 1 round short in the mag. I'm sorry but it bugs me. I can't top off the mag and put it back in like a detachable. Yes I am picky about stuff like that.
Also as mentioned before running these rounds thru the action repeatedly does damage the bullet tips, which worries me if I need to take a long range shot. Especially since it's my long range rifle, if I plan on woods hunting I take the Marlin 30-30, fields or more open areas and I take the Swede, or as my kids call it, the cannon.

I wish I could hunt with a semi in PA, but all firearms must be "manually operated" here. Yes, it sucks.
If this ever changes I'd love to take my SKS out hunting, it's very accurate with open sights, if I added a scope it would probably be MOA or better. And I have a 5, 10 and 20 round box mags for it as well as 30 round detachables to fit it.

Does anybody remember the SKS scope mounts they had years ago, that you had to drill and tap the side of the receiver to mount? I don't trust the cover mounted ones myself, I want it connected to something that don't move! Anyone know if and where I might be able to find one? I haven't seen them for years.

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from nunyabinis wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I felt the same way about detachable mags until I got my first Browning X-Bolt. That thing's slicker'n snot. I liked it so much I now own two X-Bolts.

As to affecting the stiffness/accuracy of the rifle, both my X-Bolts are tack drivers. WAY more accurate than I am.

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from olsingleshot wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

So in other words if you lose your magazine it is the rifle's fault? What if you lose your ammo, is it the rifles fault? I have several types of rifles with all different types of feeding. A magazine is the easiest, fastest, safest way to load a rifle. Do you own a semi-auto pistol, do you lose the magazine? I don't think so. If you cannot adapt to a magazine, it is not the design of the rifles proble, it's yours.

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from Ralph the Rifleman wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Gotta agree with Petzal on this issue; I don't like detach mags; WITH THE EXCEPTION of the AR and M-14 design firearms that are just perfect the way they are with a detachable magazine!
I will take issue to added weight since most modern mags are plastic that don't add much weight.

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from elmer f. wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

in a high power, bolt action, big game rifle, i agree 100%. but in a semi-auto, that i may want to use for smaller objects like coyote, or similar sized objects, i like detachable mags. why? because primarily of the laws in my state. here, we can not use a firearm that holds more than 5 rounds (including one in the chamber) semi-auto rifles (other than a 22 rimfire) for anything on public property. now, even though the chances of me NEEDING more than 5 rounds in rapid sucession are slim, if i do, i dont want to have to take all the time to dig out the rounds, and shove them into the gun and all the while, my next prospective target is running away. with a detachable mag, i simply drop the empty and slide in a new one. besides, haveing 5 loose cartridges in your coat or pants make a lot of noise, unless you put each one in a different pocket. where as a d.m. holds them all nice and tight in place keeping them quiet. besides, with a medium caliber semi-auto, the strength of the rifle is not really all that compromised. if we were talking 300 win mag or larger, that would be a different story.

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from O Garcia wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

clay cooper, but if you use that M1A with scope, stripper clips out of the question.

Z41, Nelsol, coulterboy, nice summations.

when you really think about it, for every person that dislikes a detachable mag, there's another person that absolutely hates blind magazines (OK, there's Ross Seyfried, for one, sorry Ross). the point is not to incite a flaming war, or to drop more gunwriter names, but simply to emphasize that every design has faults, and if one wants to find fault, something will be found. it's how it's built that makes a design work. with the exception of the "Chauchat" perhaps, that dang weapon has no hope of salvation in this earth.

and one still needs to use a weapon, device or tool well in order to make it work properly. no matter how well it's made. or designed.

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from WVOtter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

My dad has a nice old 22 Hornet that was his uncles, and I've hunted with it a few times myself...and that darn magazine catches on sleeves and fingers and wants to come out at the drop of a hat. Not to mention it's so loose, it doesn't line the round up with the bolt; so you have to apply pressure to the mag with one hand and close the bolt with the other. Big pain...I'd rather deal with loading and unloading every time I leave/return to the truck than that...especially on an antique sentimental rifle.

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from z41 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Dave, "Hinged floorplates pop open accidentally, but all you lose are your cartridges." What more is there to lose, you've lost it all.

It's a personal perference thing you can build a case on either side - it's where your affection is.

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from sgaredneck wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

For a bolt action I agree 100% on those d@%# detachable mags. If there was only change I could make on my Tikka T3 it would be that silly plastic mag. Lose one, and try to buy one of those and you will get angry over the cost of said silly piece of plastic. I know I've heard all the arguments about how great polymers are and I've seen the youtube videos of the AR pmag getting run over by a truck. I look at my Husqvarna 8x57 Mauser and I think they had it right way back when.

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from coulterboy wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

To each his own. It doesn't really matter what you have. Just because you don't have a rifle that doesn't have a detachable magazine, or perhaps you do, makes you think it's not worth it. Learn to familiarize with your equipment. I personally don't have a rifle with a detachable mag. All of them are hinged floorplates -SAKO, Winchester and Savage. But I will not badmouth the detachable magazine option. People complaining about the magazine accidentally dropping makes me really think they don't really pay close attention to their rifles nuances. I have been hunting in almost all scenarios - desert, thick brush, in the thickets, rain, snow or sunshine, and I don't see it in my lifetime to accidentally pop my hinged floorplate, or if I have a detachable mag, drop one. C'mon guys, sometimes it's just jealousy. I would comment more on rifle accuracy, than a petty option of a detachable mag.

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from coulterboy wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

To each his own. It doesn't really matter what you have. Just because you don't have a rifle that doesn't have a detachable magazine, or perhaps you do, makes you think it's not worth it. Learn to familiarize with your equipment. I personally don't have a rifle with a detachable mag. All of them are hinged floorplates -SAKO, Winchester and Savage. But I will not badmouth the detachable magazine option. People complaining about the magazine accidentally dropping makes me really think they don't really pay close attention to their rifles nuances. I have been hunting in almost all scenarios - desert, thick brush, in the thickets, rain, snow or sunshine, and I don't see it in my lifetime to accidentally pop my hinged floorplate, or if I have a detachable mag, drop one. C'mon guys, sometimes it's just jealousy. I would comment more on rifle accuracy, than a petty option of a detachable mag.

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from naco96 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Right on nunyabinis... the detachable mags in my X-bolts (25-06 and 270WSM)are are great and have never missed a beat. And yes mine are tack drivers as well. I think Dave has been out in the sun a bit too long because I think I remember him saying in one of his early reviews that the detachable mag of the x-bolt was one of its most positive features.
Of course if one is speaking of magazines, in my admittedly less than professional opinion, nothing beats the rotary in my model 1899 Savage 303!

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from MLH wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

By the way, Boddington has a very nice Winchester 88 in .358 Win. I know it is customized but was it converted to a blind mag or hinged floorplate?

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from Carney wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Elmer = "now, even though the chances of me NEEDING more than 5 rounds in rapid sucession are slim, if i do, i dont want to have to take all the time to dig out the rounds, and shove them into the gun and all the while, my next prospective target is running away."

I would be much more concerned about needing more bullets for a target that is running toward you -- rather than away!!! ;-)

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from Carney wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Wa Mnt Hntr = I stand corrected. Couldn't find it anywhere so I dropped by WDFW on my way past it today and they agreed with you -- carry as many bullets in your rifle as you can fit!

So, old wive's tales die hard... I bet I could pose the question to anybody at the range or the gun stores and I'd get the "3 cartridge rule".

I also agree that the hunter's ed program could stand a lot of upgrade. I've taken 3 kids through what is reputed to be "the best" in our area but it is less than sufficient.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Carney

You're not one of those toad, I mean road, hunters are you?

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

@JCB

LMAO!

@ Carney
Seen any blue light specials lately? LOL

Just kidding!

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from Beekeeper wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

My wife loves the convenience of the Browing style hinged floor plate/detachable clip of her A-Bolt Micro Hunter. This is the same type rig that Ish described above on the BAR. Shortly after I bought her the rifle a local gun dealer went belly up and had a big rummage sale on what was left after the creditors got their share. What did I find other than a treasure trove of Browning bases and rings for all kinds of stuff? Why a collection of the short action detachable A-Bolt "clips" tho fit her rifle. I paid $5 each for all 5. Sticker price had been $40 each. As a friend of mine would say, "What a bargain!"

Guess what Dave? In 4 years she has already lost 3 of the 5! I still have one of the 5 where she can't find it, in the glove box of my truck! Just in case she should need it some day when we get to the woods...

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from crm3006 wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Clay Cooper-
FYI- I have a 5 round mag. from Springfield
Armory that cuts down a lot of the bulk on my
MIA for hunting purposes. It does take a little finagling to get it out of the well, but I'm hoping it will loosen up with a little wear.

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from albertahunter wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Very interesting reading the comments. Our opinions obviously have something to do with aging. My view on issues has changed drastically over a few decades. Firstly anything I hunt with now has to work flawlessly and I find myself buying better quality accessories. Secondly I have to have confidence with whatever I am using and know its limitations. Complaints about clips falling out are valid as I found a clip in my vehicle after the season from a friend who has a pump -06. This clip did not work in my gun as well as my two. Not sure why. If you are removing a clip, do it. dont activate the release and start doing something else. the clip can fall out at anytime. when inserting a clip make sure you hear the release clik to lock it in or again, clip can fall out later. practice at home because out in the field you dont need aggravations with gear. My Remington is a bit older then me, mfg more then half a century ago and in mint condition, having only shot half a box of ammo before I got it. I have never had a clip/feeding failure of any kind in the couple decades I have had it and some of our hunting seasons are in the minus 30's. It would take a lot of $$ for me to part with it as well because it still does its job as good as possible. I must conclude we use what works best for each of us.

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from AlaskanExile wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I have to correct myself. Just for kicks, I checked on Gunbroker and found a few magazines for 788's. Most any calibers are available there and some appear to be new from Remington. I don't know if they are new old stock or actually new magazines.
A few years ago when my rifle was sitting (for about a year) in a gunsmith's shop waiting for a new barrel, he got offers several times to buy my magazines for up to $60 each. He said Remington hadn't made those in years and nobody in the aftermarket had either.

Beekeeper: That's quite a score to get 5 for $5 each.
AKX

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from Jeff Bowers wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

It seems that for once I have avoided Dave's ire.

After 22 years in the military, I have to think I just got tired of cleaning and maintaining all that stuff. I only have Remington ADLs and revolvers. I actually have to now think about why that is.

I used to have magazine-fed weapons and despised the cost. When H&K 91 mags hit $100 I quit looking at them. I later sold the rifle. I worried about any tube-fed rifle because I worried about a round up against the next primer. I think you use special rounds for those but I didn't want to have to sort ammo that way. Just lazy, I guess.

So I'm happy with the simple life now, but I do understand the attraction of magazines to some people. They are quick to reload, hold ungodly amounts of rounds, and are pretty cool.

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from beardedfarmer wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

beardedfarmer
Alot of the coments I read are from other than those of us that use over the counter "MEAT" guns. I have a model 7 Remington that the clip an excellent idea. Most of us shoot once or twice a year at game than 2 or 3 to see if the front iron sight has been knocked out alingment. Our grouping is 4 to 6 inches. Enough to kill and not leave a wounded animal in the woods. The one thing that affects out shot more than any thing is the nose of the bullet being knocked out of its original shape. So we use a clip, keep it in shape and that keeps the bullets in shape.

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from Jere Smith wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

If you can't GIT-R_DONE with the first 5 rounds, chances are even greater you won't with 5 more! EH? JMNSVHO. ( actually my Drill Sergeant IN 1959 said that in a little more salty language!

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from ggmack wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

alright i keep a ruger mini 14 with an extra mag taped to the off side of the stock in the back of my truck as a JIC gun. but when I know i will be shooting i take my A303 so yes i use a detachable mag but my first choice is a blind mag.

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from Ruckweiler wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Never had any problems with magazines on my M-16A1. Training makes all the difference and always will.

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from jherbine wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Bear hunting in PA, we put on drive after drive each day of the season. Alternating between driving and being on watch means loading and unloading quite a bit. And sometimes there is deep snow on the ground. Having a detachable magazine is much preferred as cartridges are otherwise easily dropped and lost in the snow with each unloading cycle.

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from Carney wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

WAMNTHUNTER = since when is it legal to have 4 cartridges in your rifle while hunting in WA State ?!?!?! That's like a $400 ticket, man.

Gunslinger, This is not game heaven -- it is hunter hell. Maybe it's not so bad on the east side but hunting in the Cascades for black tail is like chasing a ghost on 50 degree slopes, through tangles of vine maple in the rain. But I do love this! I do wish we had a more target rich environment as I hate investing lots of time and effort in "the hunt" with nothing but a good, challenging time to show for it. My new motto = REAL MEN HUNT BLACK TAIL!

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from Carney wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Hmm. I'll have check that out... I've not looked in print but have had a forest ranger as well as all the hunter's ed facilitators that my kids have had, lay down the 3 cartridge rule -- for big game hunting as well as waterfowl.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

@ Gunslinger

To answer your question about what is the #1 game animal locally:

Blacktail deer and black bears are pretty popular locally. East of the Cascades, it is mule deer and elk. Lots of whitetails in the Northeast, too.

If it is any indication, there were 166,000 deer tags and 105,000 elk tags sold last year. I bet most of the elk tag purchasers also bought one of the deer tags.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

@Carney

Not so, sir. The only restriction in the WA hunting regs and RCW for 3 shells is for waterfowl hunting with a shotgun.

Gunslinger

There are lots of different species but also a lot of hunters and lots of restricted land. Bears are pretty common in the NE corner of the state and west slopes of the Cascades. Tough hunting in that thick timber with lots of alder and maple during the spring and early fall.

I have a long standing treaty with Mr. Bear. He doesn't bother me and I leave him and his kin alone. My son hunts them, but I don't. I will hunt the late November blacktail season in the hills behind the house if it is cold enough and most of the leaves are gone. Otherwise, I'm quack whackin' or snow goose hunting with the dog. Usually by the time I get back from Colorado, the ducks and snow geese are in full swing! The dog is too much of a pain if I do much other than waterfowl hunt once the birds are flying.

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Carney,

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I even looked it up again.

Some of the USFS guys (not all) are a bunch of anti's and old liberal hippies and disinformation is the name of their game. Hunter Ed guys I've sat in were all good intentioned but not necessarily well armed with facts when teaching out of the NRA or national pubs put out by other agencies. Out to be a test on State Regs before you get a card IMHO.

Cheers

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Should have read; "Hunter Ed guy's classes I've sat in on were all good intentioned but not necessarily well armed with facts when teaching out of the NRA or national pubs put out by other agencies. Ought to be a test on State Regs before you get a hunter safety card IMHO."

Sorry

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

@ CARNEY

I have submitted my volunteer background check paperwork to the state to be able to work with youth in the Hunter Ed program. I think it is the same background checks like for school teachers, etc. So maybe I will have it back for next spring/summer classes. Time to give something back for a while and maybe improve the local courses which aren't bad, just could be a little better.

You are absolutely correct, those old wives tales live on forever. I asked a buddy of mine recently when was the last time he read the hunting regs cover to cover. He said about 4 years ago and said nothing ever changes. I told him that he was lucky he had not had a close encounter of the worst kind with a WDFW Enforcement Officer.

I hunt 3 states, so I am constantly reading the entire rule book of each to keep the stuff straight. Sometimes you need to be a Philadelphia lawyer to figure those things out!

Good hunting! Four weeks from today, I'll be unloading my gear at the ranch in Colorado! Neck swelling already! Time for the weekly shooting drills to commence. MOP at 400 yards is the goal.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

I've hunted with a Rem Auto for many years and no problems with the magazines. I carry one in the gun and a spare in my pocket loaded. I lways load the chamber from the mazagine so I know the magazine is feeding proper. I never drop one irectly into the chamber. 4 rounds is enough or you need pratice. Same goes now for my Bolt guns that do have floor plates and solids.All will hold 5 rounds, but again, 4 is enough.When days hunt is over using 4 rounds, I remove the one in the chamber and then re-insert into to chamber and not recycle daily as stated above. I do rotate now and then the shell I;m using to prevent damage to the point. I would be uins the 750 today out west if the guids would allow one in the chamber, but they will not and to chamber a Auto, the racket can be heard 5 miles away, as you must pull that lever all the way back and let it drop to ensure a round seats proper in the chamber.I can use any rifle as long as I'm hunting, even S/S. but prefer the old faithful 742 or the 700 CDL. Shoot-um-straight and often. PS; Keep that magazine and chamber clean on any gun.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

WA MTNHUNTER: Sounds as if you live in game heaven. We got w-tails rnning out our ears, but not quality animals. No onew will kill the Does so inbreed and now teh Bucks horns look like toothpicks.I wish I lived cle enough to Elk and Mulies to fill my tag now and then, but I;m about 2500 miles away from MT and NW C0. With my health,I'm forced to stand hunt and not go wher the game may be. But to just be out there is enjoyable. No place as beautiful as the Rocky Mtns.I was in your neck of teh woods in July of 98 for 2 weeks, saw little game, but this was not a hunt, was US Tour that wife and i had planned for years. 3-4 months on the road away from home was great, and saw lots of teh country will never see again. Unless, I find a freebie or nearly freebie hunt westward, I'm afraid my Rocky mtns hunt are history. My health has gone South this pst year and I cancelled outmy MT trip this fall. May try to find a hunt near NE Montana next year for Elk/Lopes/Mulies ifcan work a good deal with some ramcher or whom-ever. Be nice to find a club that caters to the disabled/handicapped, but they also strapped for funds as well. Have been advised to contactthe Chamber of Commerce in some of the small towns and see if they have any clubs/Ranches that would be in a range I could afford to go to. I would like at lest one more trip West while yet able to go. Health rally is going fast, but at 74 suppose to I guess. I yet am able to shoot as well as evere, just not able to walk far at all. So will hunt here for w-tails this fall and pray i can arrange a hunt Westward for next year.Hpefully the economy will improve and my retirement funds will come bac to afford a hunt. Shoot-um-sraight and often.My Son of 55 ys old, wants to go Elk hunting, hopefully I can work out something that will allow he and I to fullfill his dream and mine next season. Where you hunt B-tails, is that in the dark,damp rainforrest? How about the Bears?

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from Hunter Savage wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

to me it dont matter if it has got a hinged floor plate blind magazine or detachable mag or a single shot, i own at lest one of each type, if it is a gun its a good thing .

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from country road wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

Box mags are unnecessary in hunting rifles as far as I'm concerned. I have a Wichester with a box magazine and I carry it in my coat pocket where it collects lint, twigs, dust and other assorted detritus. If I had an autoloader, I'd want the extra mag, but for my hunting, the blind magazines on my other rifles work just fine and as has been said, is one less thing to lose or go wrong.

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from lmfansler wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I agree completely. There is no need for something that is just going to make your rifle more cumbersome and awkward. There is no reason for that. If you are in the military or you are going somewhere were you would need to have that ability to load that many rounds then maybe. However, hunting with a detachable magazine makes no sense. I mean if a cartrige isn't in the right spot you could have jams. If it is dropped and even a grain of sand in it, then you are looking at possible damage to the rifle. Detachable magazines are not logical or feasible.

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Solution?

Decaffeinated Coffee!

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from Clay Cooper wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Of all the thousands of rounds out of a M1A and M1 Garand, I never had a problem. Keep your equipment clean and in good operating condition and it will give you flawless performance!

What’s better, Hummer or a M-38 Jeep ?

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Good points, Gunslinger.

Since I usually walk in and out of my hunting area in the dark with an empty chamber, I keep 4 in the magazine and chamber one when I am ready to shoot or sit for a spell. You are correct, the autoloaders make lots of noise but are easy to unload. Clean and maintained is the key.

Best regards,
WMH

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from WA Mtnhunter wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

BTW, I'm hunting Alabama whitetails in December. As luck would have it, I'll be using one of my brother's rifles...a Remington 760 pump .270 Winchester with the dreaded detachable magazine. Beats shipping a rifle cross country. It does have a decent Bushnell Elite 3200 scope on it. It will be the first hunt ever wit ha .270 Winchester! If I like it , maybe I can talk him out of it. He He

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from crm3006 wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Clay Cooper-
A M-38 Jeep, of course. No computer, can be lifted out of a hole by one GI, can be repaired by any idiot with a pair of pliers and a little baling wire, won't stick in mud, sand, snow or rivers, will start after rain storms, sand storms, in cold or heat, and will never let you down if you add water, oil and mogas as needed.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

WAMtnhunter:After reading all the above articles, it came to me that 99% of our guns jamming problems occur due to a dirty firearm or the parts that move about. I'm a nut about clean guns,After each days hunt, I wipe/clean my guns well even if not fired. A Oily rag never shot out a gun to my knowledge, With my Auto;s with magazine,only problem I had many yrs ago was a fouled chamber. TAlked to gun smith and he informed me to buy a bronze brush, then a short handled mop and clean that chamber after a good soaking of Hopps. I did that and no problems since. I do my 700's the same. Plus to help keep trash out, I put a small piece of tape over the muzzle to keep out whatever may fall into it,especially rain or snow.I also when hunting out west, keep oil out of the mechanics of my gun and spray a tad of powder graphite on the bolt and tigger parts. In sub freezing weather rain, snow and prevent a trophy going home. Me, I not really fussy about type of gun, just give me a gun, and let hit the woods or whatever. After 60+ yrs of hunting, I can hunt with anygun, so long as I;ve shot it once before going hunting and make sure the zero is ok for me, My old eyes need a scope now, but with the Fiber Optric sights, does help on un scoped guns, especially early and late. For years I painted a red dot on my front sight and a small white V on the rear sight. Anyway, we all got our rathers, thats why so many different types made. I'm on the verge of buying a dble bbl 30-06 imported from Spain. Has a jack screw to line up the left bbl. comes with sights,but on top of action has about 8" of a grove on both sides to allow putting a Weaver type rings on. This gun at one time was imported from Russia by EAA. Now in short supply in the 45-70 (Way back ordered) I saw the gun this past week end, nothing fancy, but functional as you need for hunting. And the wt is about right for me. Lastly, it don;t cost 2 arms and both legs, less than $l500.00 POA. I don;t need it, but just want it. At 74, how many more guns will I shoot???? OK, Shoot-um-straight and very often.PS; Gun is now available in 3 Calibers. 30-06,270 and 45-70. Hey WAHunter, what is your # 1 game Animal up your way?. Also, Love my MArlin XL7 in 270. A perfect gun for rough treatment like a 4 wheeler or hauling around in my farm truck looking for Yotes. Zeroed at 200 yds, will put 3 rounds within 2-3" till bbl gets hot.Then I change gund and shoot them a while. Know a guy who puts his just fired bbls in a 5 gallon bucket of water???????? to cool off. I'd be afraid of that, but $$$ no problem to him.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Many clip magazines are a piece of junk, many even plastic (ask Rem about them ), but the drop out magazines for my Rem's work great. I do not oil the clip, only wipe with a damp rag, as the graphite makes work smother. But will agree somewhat that a solid stock gun is stronger and fits one's hand a ad better. I was un-aware that you could drop a round directly in the chamber of a Mauser action which has the CLAW? Am I wrong? And if so, by dropping directly into the chamber, will the claw catch the belt on the shell to eject? This MArlin XL7 has a Mauser type ejector, not as wide as the Custom MAuser I have but still a claw type. O was by Wally World today to view anything I must have, their shelves had less amo than my tool box has in it. Not a Box of the popular calibers and did have a few boxes of regulr Winchester's in 06 @27.95 per box. Few rounds of 22's and cheapo shotgun shells. Ammo is had to find, I can;t find any of the Rem, Scirocco's, should have a plenty, but like to stock-pile a few extra Boxes,in case I won a Far off HUNT.May need to geta buddy to load a few rounds for me for pratice, but when hunt time comes I want the real thing of top quality available, not the WW specials. I mention on one of the Topics that the dble bbl 06 Iwant, made in Spain had a Oak stock, a mistake, it is oil smooth Walnut of top quality, a tad large grip, but may require such on such a gun???? Now to find a dealer who has one that I want and price I can live with.I think Rem screwed up when they bought them out from EAA and then charged moe than dble for a few they made. Now rem has dropped them and I can get one from Spain as the supply comes available.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

I have often wondered why many Custom rifles were made on Mauser actions due to that fact. I;m no expert by any means,but don;t see how the claw can catch the belt of the bullet to retrive.I do own a Custon Nauser, made in Germany/Italy and you cannot drop one in the chamber and close the bolt.I never used a lot of pressure to force the bolt down, as have seen many claws ruined by doing so. However, regardless if can or can;t, i prefer to feed from the magazine, then I kmow the 4 bulles are stacked correct and the other 3 will feed proper. A must on a clip or hingd magazine or plain stock , is to insert the bullet heel first into the chamber holding, not the tip.But in haste, have scewed up and reversed the filling and then you got a jam on your hands and watch the game flee. I got a old Rem Sportsman 48 12 ga HAD FOR 59 YRS AND IT WOULD NOT HOLD BUT 3 SHELLS. i USED IT FOR DEER ONLY so had the 2 indentions on opposite sides bored out so would hold 5 rounds.When bird hunting I use a Pencil to drop back to 3 rounds.Its a old gun but yet shoot perfect, never jammed period. Looks as if new othe than wood has darken.Blueing is 90%. Gun has killed many deer withBuck Shot over the years down East,as we had no deer here in the Mtns, but man have we got them now.Bow season is open, then Rifle begins No. 8th and runs thru Jan.2nd, 2010. Should get my fill of hunting in nearly 2 months. I am unable to pull a Bow,so I miss the Bow Season which is now open. Shoot-um-straight and often.

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from Gunslinger wrote 4 years 29 weeks ago

I wish I could bow hunt, but not abe to drw back the thing, so just wait till gun season .wITH A EXTA WEEK of b/pwder AND 2 WEEKS OF RIFLE,SHOULD get in enough hunting I suppose. But so far have not. LAst year I hunted over 52 days. If was able to walk and bird hunt would be even more days afield.Suppose in our old age, we suppose to get out our fishing tackle and forget hunting?????WRONG, will hunt as long as can get out in the woods. Saw a Cartoon with a guy lying in a Hosp bed on the back of a pickup, nurse beside him ,gun in his lap, all kinda tubes run to him and it says, this may be my last hunt.Two yrs ago had this hunt lined up in MT but got dble Pnemunia in both lungs and was in hospital for 3 weeks. This was only 2 weeks prior to my trip. MAn was I weak. But Dr. Gave nme enough RX's and a letter for a Dr in Mt if I needed one. So I went and killed a nice Mulie. Something about hunting will get us well fast I we had 12 months of hunting, I would be out most days or part of. In N.C. they do not allow hunting. Suppose we hunters need a day off, I know I do. Ok, guys, shoot um and often.

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from Zermoid wrote 4 years 30 weeks ago

Gunslinger,

I've always been told that a Mauser Claw extractor can be broken by closing it on a round, they have to be fed from the mag or risk breakage. Don't know if new guns based on Mauser are any different or not. Mine is an old Swedish 98 stamped that it was made in 1941, if I remember right.

Anyone Know for sure if this is correct? Dave?

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from FloridaHunter1226 wrote 4 years 17 weeks ago

Never really had anything against them but have never bought a rifle with a detachable magazine because I have liked the other. I now have something against detachable magazines. But another point to add.... who do you think you have to buy another magazine from after you loose 'em.... maybe the manufacturers and gun companies have found a way to make a lot more money than usual than with fixed magazines.

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from MReeder wrote 1 year 32 weeks ago

Double Amen to DEP.
With the exception of an old Lee Enfield No. 4 MK I picked up recently to play with, the only detachable magazine rifle I have ever owned is an old J.C. Higgins Model 103.228 .22 bolt action that I inherited from my dad. I've never had much opportunity to go squirrel or rabbit hunting with it, since most of my small game hunting has been on public land where rifles are not legal. Best guess would be that I've taken it hunting maybe a dozen times, and yet I've had to replace the damned magazine three times. The release is just about where I cradle it with my hand and somewhere along the line I would release it and never know it was missing until I got back to my truck.
Everything else I own is either a blind box or a hinged floorplate and I've never had any trouble with any of them. If you can't hit some poor creature with the three to five cartridges already available it's not too likely it's going to stand around and pose for you while you fish out another detachable magazine. Just something else to go wrong.

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from Mauser M03 wrote 3 years 27 weeks ago

In my Mauser M03 I can choose if I want to lock the magazine securely in place and feed/empty from the top or if I want to use it as a conventional detachable mag. If you ask me there are pros and cons for both solutions, so why not have both? For accuracy, it groups at about 1/2" @ 100yards, plenty good enough for most hunting.

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from J.B.H wrote 1 year 31 weeks ago

exactely. with firearms, it helps to keep things simple and it seems that the simpler things are, the more reliable. I really do wish that they stop doing that. Good post Mr. Petzal

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from Nicholas Rice wrote 1 year 32 weeks ago

Okay has anyone considered that in order to keep gun rights for all of us you have to eliminate (as much as possible) ID10T mistakes. Considering the good rifles that get bad raps such as when a dumb but has his/her hand over muzzle of gun with a loaded round, Has it ever occured that detachable mags in weird way prevent that? You made the statement and I quote: "I’ve heard it said that detachable magazines “…make it easier to load and unload your rifle.” True, but how hard is it to cycle three cartridges through the action or drop a floorplate?" Well my rifle doesn't have a floor plate or a detachable mag. It does have a three position and yes I do cycle the rounds out. However the man who sold me the gun bought it originally for the half-safe position on the safety becuase one of his buddies had be unloading a bolt in his truck and it was one of these rifles where you have to have the safety on fire to work the bolt.... You can see where this going can't you. As he moved the bolt forward the gun went off and put a nice .270 cal hole in the floorboard of his truck. Now most of us are smart enough not to wait until a we are in a moving vehicle to unload a rifle this is true. But we all know not to trust any mechanical device such as safety 100% or we should. Cycling the shells out on some weapons especially bolts, levers and pumps.(most automatics have a removable mag meaning the only shell to extract is the one in the chamber when your done. A fact that careful thinking about things has made me more appreciative of things.) in creases the chance of the shell going off all while making my gun safe. No it's not hard to cycle the rounds and I always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction but a detachable not only makes it faster but I'm not exposing more than one shell at time to that firing pin. Math is simple no mag no bullets in the gun. At this point I'll make it feed right I wish almost all firearms had detachable mags. As with all problems this is not fool proof but I think I've made my point if it helps I want it.

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from Nicholas Rice wrote 1 year 32 weeks ago

Okay has anyone considered that in order to keep gun rights for all of us you have to eliminate (as much as possible) ID10T mistakes. Considering the good rifles that get bad raps such as when a dumb but has his/her hand over muzzle of gun with a loaded round, Has it ever ocured that detachable mags in weird way prevent that? You made the statement and I quote: "I’ve heard it said that detachable magazines “…make it easier to load and unload your rifle.” True, but how hard is it to cycle three cartridges through the action or drop a floorplate?" Well my rifle doesn't have a floor plate or a detachable mag. It does have a three position and yes I do cycle the rounds out. However the man who sold me the gun bought it originally for the half-safe position on the safety becuase one of his buddies had be unloading a bolt in his truck and it was one of these rifles where you have to have the safety on fire to work the bolt.... You can see where this going can't you. As he moved the bolt forward the gun went off and put a nice .270 cal hole in the floorboard of his truck. Now most of us are smart enough not to wait until a we are in a moving vehicle to unload a rifle this is true. But we all know not to trust any mechanical device such as safety 100% or we should. Cycling the shells out on some weapons especially bolts, levers and pumps.(most automatics have a removable mag meaning the only shell to extract is the one in the chamber when your done. A fact that careful thinking about things has made me more appreciative of things.) in creases the chance of the shell going off all while making my gun safe. No it's not hard to cycle the rounds and I always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction but a detachable not only makes it faster but I'm not exposing more than one shell at time to that firing pin. Math is simple no mag no bullets in the gun. At this point I'll make it feed right I wish almost all firearms had detachable mags. As with all problems this is not fool proof but I think I've made my point if it helps I want it.

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from westkybanded wrote 4 years 31 weeks ago

I'm sure you also subscribe to the belief that such weapons only belong on foreign battlefields? Live and let live.

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